Free-For-All Friday 7/17/15
Decatur Metro | July 17, 2015 | 7:00 amFeel free to use this post to make comments and ask questions about local issues not yet discussed here over the past week.
Feel free to use this post to make comments and ask questions about local issues not yet discussed here over the past week.
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I could use some legal advice. I was given a ticket a few nights ago by Dekalb police for failing to stop at a stop sign (N. Druid at Clairmont- you know the one). Maybe like everyone else I rolled through it- who knows. I went to pay online and the amount is $304 plus fees. A bit excessive I think. I have no record and haven’t even been pulled over in the last 18 years of driving, so I honestly thought I’d get off with a warning.
First question: The charge name is listed as” 6AX – FAILURE TO OBEY STOP SIGN/ACCIDENT.” Does this sound correct (there was no accident involved)? I tried to view a fee schedule and could not find one.
2nd question: Is it worth appearing in court? Any chance the charge would get dismissed or the fee reduced? If there’s no chance then I’ll just pay the fine and save myself the delightful court experience.
Thanks in advance.
It’s hard to say what would happen in court because it’s a whole new world over there. DeKalb Recorders Court was just recently euthanized and jurisdiction over traffic citations handed over the State Court. How that will work in practice is an open question. I would not ordinarily expect to be able to talk them into a reduced fine (you’ll more likely pay MORE with court costs and fees if you don’t pay it ahead of time) but you may have an interesting situation if the cop recorded it as an accident-involved event when it wasn’t. You may also be able to get a reasonable solicitor to amend the charge to a basic rules violation or other non-moving violation (much better options than a nolo contendre plea, for various reasons) that wouldn’t get reported to DDS, to keep it off your record and hidden from your insurance company.
And whether or not this info helps, I can’t help but let out a Nelson laugh and say “HAHA!” I watch people get pulled over for running that stop sign several times a week. NOBODY (besides me, of course) EVER comes to a complete stop there!
It should be a yield sign, and they know it.
But until it’s changed back to a yield sign, like it was before that intersection was reconfigured a few years ago, people should stop at it, whether they know it or not 🙂 Gotta pay all those indicted CEOs, sheriffs and commissioners somehow!
Yup. I make sure I stop. It was hard when it first switched over, though.
I play stop sign roulette there. I slow down well before the sign and check out who’s behind me. If someone’s in the car with me, I bet them on whether the driver behind me honks at me when I fully stop. If it’s a 40-something woman with a baby seat in an SUV, I’m always betting yes!
I’ve been honked at from behind for coming to a complete stop at that stop sign.
You are too funny. Like they care.
Reminds me of a scene from the Sopranos, where Tony and Paulie and shaking down the heir to a local garbage collection business. The kid makes an impassioned plea to Tony, citing the imperatives of fairness and justice. Tony turns to Paulie and says, “can you f__ believe this guy?”
Haha. Good stuff.
There have been many accidents there over the years, even after they rebuilt that intersection some time ago. You just can’t see the speedsters flying down Clairmont to beat the light.
I think an actual yield sign would be going to far; A rolling stop is certainly sufficient to provide a clear view and safe entry.
That being said, the fanatic enforcement there is – or should be – an embarrassment for DeKalb PD. It’s all about the revenue, and they know it.
You are not alone. We full stop, make sure the car rocks before proceeding, every time.
there is a good chance you can have it reduced if you go to court since you haven’t had any tickets. whether it is worth your time is the question. my experience at the Dekalb county recorder’s court a couple years ago was: I showed up to the courtroom at the time assigned with about 200 other people on various charges ranging from traffic tickets like me to minor drug and parole offenses. then I stood in line to talk to a DA representative who reduced my speeding ticket so it did not give me any points on my license. I did have to pay a substantial fine, pay for parking, pay a court fee and pay to use the money machine on site since they only take cash and I had no idea what my final amount would be. Not to mention a half a day of time to go there. It seemed like a big shakedown by Dekalb county, somebody is probably getting kickbacks for the parking deal etc. I do not think I was speeding but the option I had was to return another day and roll the dice again, so I took the fine. I noticed this week WSB had a story about a lawsuit involving this court. Once again, something smells rotten in dekalb county…
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/lawsuit-alleges-dekalb-county-court-mishandled-tra/nmzWr/
Recorders Court is no more.
http://recorders.dekalbcountyga.gov/
$304 is wildly excessive, shameful, and lays bare the true purpose of the ticket — pure revenue generation.
Plus a $15.21 “convenience” fee for paying online!
A few years ago I had to pay a “service charge” even though I paid cash at the court house.
But you breathed their air for free, right? So you have that, at least.
I think the air is what cost the additional 20%.
ticket prices are way higher across the board. What used to be a $75 ticket is now nearly $400. I guess that’s a good incentive to pay attention…
I am now realizing for the first time that is no longer a yield sign. That is probably saying as much about the intersection as it is about me.
I had to go to traffic court earlier this year. I’ll echo all that WP said. Lucky for me the courthouse is near my work, but is was painful to sit there in the chaos. No reduction in fines were allowed for any cases I heard, but I was able to plead Nolo with the DA and not have it reported to my insurance. You only get to do that once in a certain amount of time.
If you decide to go to court, I highly recommend getting there much earlier than your court time. I was there about 3.5 hours, but probably could have shortened that time if I had gotten in line earlier. Also if you pay your fee after your case, you must either bring cash or pay an upcharge to use your credit card. I forget the exact amount, but think it was an additional 15%.
They lied to you. Nolo pleas get reported to DDS, go on your driving history and thus are visible to the insurance company. It’s treated just like a guilty plea for most purposes. All it does is keep points being assessed on your license, which is not a big deal unless you’re under 21 or close to a suspension because of prior convictions. You’re better off saving the Nolo for a more serious charge or an accident.
Go try and talk to soliciter. See what they will do. If nothing, plead nolo and take reduced fine.
Thanks. Do you have a recommendation by any chance?
Good morning, Decatur! Happy Friday!
I have two Triple-Slider tickets for the Decatur Slide the City event on July 25 that I will not be using. If you would like to buy them, I will sell them for what I paid: $69.02. Heck, I’ll cut you a deal and sell ’em for $69 even! (They were $35 each, minus the 10% DBA discount, plus tax/service charge.)
Email me at airemama @ comcast dot net if you’re interested.
Thanks!
First time here, so not sure if replying to above post or leaving my own. At any rate, writing for my husband, who is selling his 1983 Volvo wagon (DL 240, Hunter green). Has owned for last 16 years, been serviced at Pete’s Import on Dekalb Avenue that entire time. Good “grocery getter”. Selling for $1500. Please call Monroe at 404-210-1090.
Allow me to offer a shout-out to Decatur Presbyterian, now that the dust has settled on their landscape work. Between the plaza allowing their congregation to better connect with the street life outside to the Charleston-worthy pocket garden at the corner, it’s really shaping up to be a first-rate contribution to downtown. Tying back to Chris’ earlier comment about private money and effort creating a public good, this here’s a good one. And I think it will only grow more endearing as it ages.
It is nice. I believe the pocket garden is where they plant their deceased members.
Ha! I meant the full corner, not just the Memorial Garden but yeah. It’s all quite nice.
Quick shredding question: Where can I go to get a box of docs shredded outside of the twice-annual recycling event?
Your bank may have a shredder and a recycling program for customers. Especially the smaller ones who need to differentiate via better customer service.
Keep Atlanta Beautiful runs monthly events in Old Fourth Ward and in Buckhead. Can’t remember which days but easy to google.
Keep DeKalb Beautiful is having a recycling & shredding event at Northlake Mall’s parking lot on Saturday, July 25 from 9 a.m. – noon.
Recycle your old electronics, shred your old documents and donate gently used shoes! Come join us and bring your old tax records, legal documents, etc. for free on-site shredding (limit of (5) standard size boxes per person). Recycle old computers, televisions, cell phones, game consoles or anything with a cord. We are also recycling gently used shoes. (Accepted Shoes: Sneakers, Casual Shoes, Dress Shoes, Sandals, Heels, Flats. No ski/winter boots, slippers or rubber flip flops please).
Flyer: http://web.dekalbcountyga.gov/beautiful/pdf/ERecyclingPaperShredding_07072015.pdf
Thanks for this heads-up Mimi. I need both shredding and electronics recycling, so this is perfect.
Befriend a medical person. I take all my papers to work to throw in one of the hospital many huge shred boxes.
Recommendations on someone to build an affordable back yard deck please.
I posted last week about the issues with AT&T Uverse internet. I set up an appointment for them to come yesterday evening. They left a voicemail on my wife’s phone saying they could not find a tech to come by. This was at 7:30pm and they were supposed to come between the hours of 4pm to 8pm.
They were nice enough to give me a $15 credit (only took a 30 minute phone call) and are supposed to come back again by 12:30pm this morning. We shall see.
I find in crazy that the AT&T rep gives you a four hour time frame when they can send someone to your house and then at the very end of that time frame they call and say they don’t have anyone available for this. Reminds me of a Seinfeld episode where Jerry debates with someone on what the purpose of a reservation is.
Our Uverse internet and tv have been out since last Tuesday. 10 days and counting right now. Technician came out the first day and told us the problem was a bad exterior line and he’d put in a work order for it. Found out yesterday that, despite repeated calls and assurances that the problem was being addressed, nobody was ever assigned to fix it. Probably spent a total of 4 or 5 hours on the phone with various customer service reps, managers and technicians. They swear it will be fixed today. The $15 credit they’ve currently offered us is obviously not going to cut it. Google Fiber can’t get here fast enough.
I remember you mentioned this last week. They only offered you a $15 credit too?
Our internet works but it will cut out every so often for a minute or so and lags more than it should. We only have 12 mbps but it has typically been fast enough for what we need it to do (appleTV, a few tabs and smart phones, and a desktop on the home network).
We don’t use their TV (we use directv and I have always been happy with their product and customer service).
The one manager did say they would revisit the credit issue after it was finally fixed, to at least reflect the time it’s been out. I told her that was a start, but they’d also have to account for the time and effort and hassle it cost me, especially for all the time after the first day when they dropped the ball by never even putting in a service ticket. We shall see what comes of this.
I came *this close* to switching to U-Verse for internet and TV a few months ago. I still have Earthlink DSL (am I the only person who still does? We have unlimited data, too) and Dish Network. The main reason for the switch was because our Dish bill was outrageous, just for the lowest tier of HD channels, and no extra channels (HBO etc.) . I wasn’t unhappy with Earthlink but I thought it would be cheaper to bundle internet and TV, and I thought the internet speeds might be faster with U-Verse. Before I pulled the trigger I called Dish to see if they would lower my bill, and they did, by more than half every month. So I still have Earthlink and Dish and reading these comments makes me sooo glad. Our internet rarely, if ever goes down, and Dish only goes down during a storm, then comes right back up.
Periodically U-Verse has reps in our neighborhood trying to convert the holdouts with really great deals. I think I’ll remain a holdout!
Never let go of your Earthlink DSL because if you do, you can never get it back (and you will want to!). I had Earthlink for years and was perfectly happy with it. But I let ATT seduce me into a bundle of wireless, landline (which I needed for work), and Internet. Of course, it wound up involving some bait-and-switch. And as my needs changed over time and I wanted to adjust levels of service on different pieces, I was trapped. But the ATT DSL connection was rock-solid for years. Then I moved to Atlanta and had WiFi included in my condo fee. Grew dissatisfied with it and discovered Earthlink doesn’t sell new DSL subscriptions any more. I tried to get a DSL line with ATT but they refuse to provision that any longer and forced me to get UVerse instead. Turns out the trunk facilities in this part of town are a mess, so it took them forever to get the UVerse connection up and running. It performs OK but they are constantly screwing up the bill.
We had Earthlink DSL for almost a decade. It wasn’t great, but the uptime was rock solid and unbeatable. And when there were problems, instead of the AT&T runaround (where you are lucky if the service rep on the phone knows what a DSL line vs a phone line is), you got something forwarded to engineering who worked with people on the technical backside of AT&T (I think Earthlink used them and leased bandwidth?) to figure out where the problem was.
I even had the DSL modem on a UPS and in some storms we had internet service even when the power was out briefly 🙂
On the downside, back in 2008 I upgraded our service from 1.5 to 3.0 Mb/sec. When complained that nothing seemed to change, they reminded me I was only paying for the best “possible” service ….
I had Mindspring DSL, which became Earthlink, for nearly 15 years, and it was great. But it just became too slow and I finally switched to Comcast, with great trepidation. I have been pleasantly surprised that our service has only gone out once since I switched. However, I will switch to Google Fiber at the earliest available opportunity. I trust them more than the cable company because they want people online whereas the cable companies just want to drain money from their customers.
We live on the same street and have had trouble with our AT & T land line for the last six weeks. First they said it was a problem with inside wiring, and before we could have someone come look at it, service was miraculously restored during a lightning storm last month. It went out again this last weekend. Two days ago an automated message on my cell said it was fixed, except it was still totally dead. So no phone service in three of the last six weeks and still not working. I’ll have to ask for a credit, too.
Also live on Garden Lane. About 3 months ago we had to switch to Comcast things got so bad. Their system fried 2 U-Verse modems within a span of about a month. Getting Comcast set up was a PITA, but nothing compared to AT&T (may they rot in hell). Time for Google fiber over here for sure.
We recently had AT&T U-verse installed, internet and TV. My husband is a network engineer and worked with the first installer to get it the way he wanted (more complicated than a standard installation), and then the service went out after a couple of days–of course when techie husband was out of town! AT&T sent over an amazing technician next–his name is Anderson Clay. After carefully listening to me and my husband’s description of the setup and the problems, he knew exactly what to do and then spent hours fixing the problem *the right way.* We’ve had no problems since. I have his personal cell number and his supervisor’s name and number. Hesitant to post it here but message me at pilatesheather_at_yahoo(dot)com and I will share it with you.
I have UVerse and have also always had good experiences with the actual tech people UVerse sends out. In fact, I’ve had nothing but good experiences with all the customer support people.
The problem I have with Uverse, as is noted above, is that their internet connections speeds are slow compared to what’s offered by other companies. Comcast/XFINITY advertises download speeds of up to 50 bps, while the best Uverse can do for me is 18 bps. The only reason I haven’t switched is because of the complete horror stories I’ve read about Comcast customer service.
Mine has been generally spotty these last few weeks, although fine for the most part this week. A neighbor’s went out entirely, so they called support. AT&T ignored their first appointment entirely. They arrived for the second and simply replaced all of the equipment, forcing my neighbors to reset all of their devices to be compatible. We’ll see if this improves connectivity . . .
This is pretty much the exact same thing that happened to us. They missed the 1st appointment and came the next day after I called them. When they were here they replaced our lines, put a new box on the side of the house, and gave us a new modem. It seems to be working fine now.
My wife said she thinks the tech was new because it took him 4 or 5+ hours to do all this. Plus he locked his keys in his car twice during the time he was at our house. The second time he locked them in the trunk and they had to tow his truck back to their base. Did a pretty good job though and I am happy it is working better than ever now.
Need help with some long neglected Japanese maples. Can anyone suggest an experienced tree pruner ?
Boutte Tree. (404)799-5472 A little pricey but they do an amazing job and very professional.
Wilton Street orange flag on parked silver car = +1!
For those wondering what happened on Ponce yesterday afternoon to cause the epic Eastbound traffic jam — a dump truck went off the road and down about 20 feet of embankment to the edge of Lullwater Creek. Then the towing crew had to shovel off all the dirt and kudzu dragged up onto the road by the truck.
There will be a substantial scar in the underbrush for quite some time.
My very sweet 7-year-old Golden Retriever has suddenly developed full-blown, very severe separation anxiety. He cannot be left alone for even a few minutes without becoming destructive to the point of causing self-injury. Has anyone worked with an Animal Behaviorist to successfully treat Separation Anxiety in their dog? Thanks for any input!
We have not had any specific separation anxiety issues with our dog, but when we first got her we got excellent advice and support from Frogs to Dogs at 2006 Hosea L. Williams Drive Atlanta, GA 30317. 404-735-6237 http://frogstodogs.com/
They are very patient and thorough, and I would go to them first if I had any behavioral issues with our girl. Best of luck in getting some answers to this perplexing issue.
Meredith Minkin Canine PhD 404-931-2035
Our dog is much improved after 2 months of work. She has MANY issues and we are probably looking at lifetime management – but feel confident that we are working with the right trainer. Whatever you do, don’t let anyone talk you into shock collers for anxiety management.
I recommend Dr John C Wright–he is a PhD animal behaviorist who works with dogs and cats. Makes house calls. His webpage at Mercer University provides more info. See http://cla.mercer.edu/psychology/faculty/j_wright/
Dr Wright was of great help with my dog several years ago. Good luck!
While the path you are taking is a good one, medication should not be out of the question. Prozac did wonders for my dog’s anxiety. Night and day.
The Walrus, did you have to keep going up on the medication dosage? Just started our dog on this path, and was wondering if the first dosage did the trick?
Too early to tell – she has only been on it for about a month. The change has been incredible.
Just got this sad notice from Southern Sweets :
“The Southern Sweets Bakery Family is saddened today as founder Nancy Cole passed away this morning surrounded by loved ones. Her family would like to sincerely thank you for the outpouring support during this time. We would like to invite you to come celebrate Nancy’s life, here at the bakery. We are planning now and will announce a date soon to honor the life of this remarkable woman.”
RIP. Such a great place she created. Hope her establishment lives on for many years to come.
Folks, it’s time to show DM some love and bring Best Local Blog and Blogger back home where it belongs! Deadline is midnight, July 19th. We gotta get crackin’ and VOTE!
http://posting.clatl.com/atlanta/Survey?survey=14505985
Gunnery Sgt. Thomas Sullivan, Lance Cpl. Squire Wells, Staff Sgt. David Wyatt, and Sgt. Carson Holmquist.
As a community, Decatur should mourn with Chattanooga and the rest of the nation for the loss of these four Marines whose lives were taken by the violent acts of an extremist. Prayers for their families as they bury and grieve for the loss of their loved ones.
Yes. And thank you for posting.
We do mourn, Marty. We do.
Just wanted to post a reminder to my friends on DM about the super-aggressive booting on Commerce Square by Selig Enterprises. I live right around the corner and have shopped and dined there for over a decade but I’m never going back. The booting company informed me they actually have spies in the parking lot watching and calling in anyone who steps foot off their section of the parking lot. So, instead of one of these informants politely telling me that I was not allowed to leave their lot, even for a moment, they boot my car and charge me $95 to have it removed. I have spent thousands of dollars at Jazmin Spa, Pastries a-go-go, Seventeen Steps, CVS etc. over the years and likely would have spent thousands more in the future. Now, I’m through with them and am letting everyone know why.
You realize it’s the businesses there that want (and pay to have) parking enforced, right? Why would you think it’s okay to “borrow” their parking when the lot is clearly posted? Wouldn’t you expect to be at risk of towing if you parked at any of the other nearby posted lots? Or to risk a ticket if you overstayed a meter?
I agree it’s private property for the benefit of the tenants but are we sure the present enforcement is being driven by them? All my inquiries have resulted in a sort of “it’s the property owner, not us” kind of response. Are they just scapegoating Selig for something they’ve chosen to do?
I have a friend who works for Selig in a high managerial position and she has warned me about parking in that lot if I’m not shopping there. Interestingly, she has told me the same about the Publix at Emory Commons. That would lead me to believe that it is a Selig policy and not the business owners.
While I understand parking enforcement, I wish there could be a grace period. For example, I parked there for an appointment that I thought was at 3:00, but it was at 4:00. I decided to stay and walk around some shops, and ended up crossing the street for about 30 minutes, then came back for my appointment. I would have been extremely upset to find my car booted. It didn’t make sense for me to move my car across the street for 30 minutes, especially at a busy and often congested intersection with few other parking options.
You may be the very first person to actually admit to 30 minutes instead of just a few ! :0)
Don’t you think it could get a bit out of hand if there was a grace period and just about everyone used it?
Actually, not really. Most of the time I go there, it’s just to one or two shops. I usually don’t need to leave my car there for any reason and I was legitimately there for an appointment when I did leave my car that time. But maybe other people would intentionally abuse the grace period…”oh I’m going into CVS…and right back out the other entrance to a store NOT in this center…” Who knows. Just glad I got away with leaving the premises for a short time and know now I won’t take that risk again.
If I were the parking lot booter, I’d especially enjoy booting the dart-through CVS folks! :0)
“she has told me the same about the Publix at Emory Commons. ”
But there aren’t non-Selig properties conveniently across the street there, so the issue doesn’t come up.
That mostly likely would have to do with Emory folks parking to catch the bus.
Well, I didn’t realize Selig owns all the shopping centers at N. Decatur and Clairmont…but she did say they strictly enforce it there, so who knows why–maybe Emory employees and/or students try to park and ride from there illegally?
That happens to be another intersection where, if I have to go to several stores (say Rainbow Grocery, Petco, Publix, and Kinko’s), I would rather park at one location and walk to the others rather than moving my car several times. I just wish I didn’t have to risk my car getting booted to do so.
Selig owns Emory Commons only of the shopping centers at that intersection.
You don’t think it’s rolled into their rents? I’m pretty sure all overhead costs for a shopping center are factored in. (Taxes, maintenance, etc.)
Scott, while I don’t think business owners will come out and say they want it enforced as strictly as it is, look at it from their perspective: a number of popular businesses sharing a medium sized lot. If it’s a choice of the spaces not turning or folks frustrated because they can’t use the lot as base for their downtown errands, I believe I’d nod along sympathetically to the folks booted while being glad that the parking company is ON IT.
Posted below before I saw this. As I said, I’m not arguing against the booting. I support the right of a property owner to manage a valuable commodity. I’m only trying to determine who’s responsible for the manner of enforcement taking place.
Don’t you think it would have been better, since they have people on site watching (possibly store employees), that they could have approached me to let me know this is their policy. Instead of immediately calling in the booting company?
In any case, private property owners certainly do have a right to behave this way towards their customers. And I promise to never again trespass on their private property.
While I agree it’d be nice, I’d also bet that 99% of fyi’s would be met with “But I’ll just be a quick 5 minutes.” To nip it, the booting company most likely has a strict No Talk: Boot ‘Em policy.
Primadonnamomma, you had a bad $95 lesson. It’d be a shame to let it cause you to give up favorite businesses you’ve long enjoyed. Hopefully, you won’t end up punishing yourself.
Guess I’m stubborn that way, Deanne, but Commerce Square just made its last $95 on me.
The warning signs are posted all over that lot. Zero tolerance is necessary there – look what’s right across the street – a restaurant with WAY too little parking to accommodate all its patrons. Be realistic – nobody can afford to police every patron to make sure they just ran a short errand off property instead of spending the better part of an hour in a restaurant. Commerce Square could just decide to meter all it’s parking bays.
I would assume that’s a possibility, though the suggestion from merchants seems to be that their leasing rates haven’t changed, they’re not behind the booting, and/or they didn’t hire the booters So if they want and are paying to have it done, as you said, they’re being two-faced about it when asked.
Not to argue the right to enforce private parking. It’s a valuable commodity and, as you say, tenants (or more specifically, their customers) are paying for free parking via the cost of products and services. I had just not previously heard that it was the tenants managing the booting program. You’re more in the know on this one than me, though, so I’ll take your word for it.
Don’t you think it would have been better, since they have people on site watching (possibly store employees), that they could have approached me to let me know this is their policy. Instead of immediately calling in the booting company?
In any case, private property owners certainly do have a right to behave this way towards their customers. And I will never again trespass on their private property.
That’s why I was trying to get to the root of who implemented the program. Because I, like you, think a warning first would be a good policy and would ultimately serve to not alienate patrons such as yourself. If that were my property, that’s probably how I would handle it. But since it’s not, I’m just going to have to grumble at the dent it makes in my convenience. I was just curious who I should picture in my mind as I’m grumbling.
As an aside, I wouldn’t be surprised if no one — not Selig, not tenants — is paying the booting company and that the agreement just allows them to be the booter-of-record and to be paid solely according to the cars they boot. In that case, the profit incentive for the booter would be entirely quantity-based and would explain why they’re not going out of their way to inform anyone.
Your business model for the booting company is more than likely correct and they would have an agreement with Selig, not the tenants, to do what they do. The parking company, not the tenants, would also hire the “monitors”,
As an additional comment, there are times when that lot is almost entirely, if not completely, full, so I guess the other side of the argument is that the landlord is just trying to make sure that the parking is being use for his tenants.
I think you’re right about that being the more likely business model. Still, it’d be a basic lease term for the landlord to ensure adequate parking. (It’s why shopping center owners are careful with their mix of businesses to best stagger parking needs.) So, when circumstances dictate, it’d be on the landlord to take additional measures to address. Since everybody likes free parking and this is a conveniently located lot, it’s easy to see why actual enforcement is necessary.
I am definitely shopping less at that shopping plaza since I heard about the booting. I’m still in a hectic stage of life between work and home and I look for efficiencies. It used to be efficient to cover several places on West Ponce at once–CVS, Pastries A Go Go, Delta Community, Verizon, Sawicki’s, the county voting spot, and maybe the smoothie place or Jimmy Johns. But its equally easy to hit a CVS on my commute home or over by DeKalb Medical, get items at Oakhurst Market when I’m around there, and use my work credit union ATM. I think it’s a bad business model for everyone but the booting company. But may be I don’t understand the level of abuse of that parking lot. I have never noticed it being misused and wonder if it’s a huge problem–maybe when events are going on in Downtown Decatur. It would seem to be cheaper to only use a booting company during those events.
$95?!? Thank you for letting us know about the booting. $95 is outrageous and is akin to usury with a taste of entrapment added in. I too will now boycott every business in that plaza. And sorry business owner/property rights/ booting apologists – Decatur isn’t THAT bad to park in and the fee is just nuts.
Everyone should be aware that CoD has implemented a strict set of guidelines under which these bottom feeding predators must operate. For instance They HAVE to take credit cards and not just cash like one recently told me. (If they do tell you “cash only”, get their name and find out who the property owner is it indicates they are trying to hide that revenue from them. One property owner I told this to was happy to learn it was happening.)
That’s really interesting, Eric. They told me they only take cash or debit card. I just happened to have a debit card on my that I rarely use, but I certainly don’t routinely carry $95 in cash,.
It’s definitely not cool that happened. Do you still have your receipt? If so, it seems fair to ask one of the Commerce Square businesses you went to that day to step in to bring it to Selig’s attention. Maybe it could get resolved in your favor.
Deputy Chief Lee says that officers aren’t receiving complaints of credit cards not being a payment option. Complaints are about being booted and booter’s attitude. (He tactfully didn’t comment on bootees’ attitudes, but did say officers stick around to ensure everything ends without incident.) He confirmed that the booting program is in compliance with city ordinance.
(primadonnamomma- This was an overall inquiry, not aimed at your accounting.)
I don’t think most people know about the rule that they are supposed to accept credit cards. This is the first time I’ve ever been booted, so It’s not something I’ve studied up on. But now that I’m aware, I will let the authorities know.
I just walked four extremely sad looking drivers in the section by the CVS drive-through waiting to have boots removed at 1:30 Sunday.
I live in the Artisan. Sitting on my balcony (on Commerce) on a recent Sunday morning, it was like a reality TV show watching the booting and angst.
Some observations:
1) Most of the people being booted are obviously walking off property (Teds, Taco Mac,Thumbs Up)
2) The signage is quite obvious — about every 3 parking spaces. They are compliant with the law. The police are getting called a lot — and tell the car owners the same thing (we hear all the calls on the police scanner)
BUT …. if they REALLY wanted to free up parking spots, they would just tell the people to leave. I bet most people would.
3) But they don’t. The parking lot attendant watches people leave, then gets out the boot. And as others have noted online, there are also situations like the guy waiting on a prescription refill who walks off property and gets booted.
The parking lot owner and businesses have a legitimate grip. But the way it is being handled is rather thoughtless. Why not gate the lot and offer validation? I think the real answer is $$$ — hiring a parking company likely costs Selig nothing or next to nothing, compared to any other option. And I’m sure the parking company works on commission.
Sooner or later that real-estate will be too valuable for a surface parking lot anyway …
I investigated this, and spoke to the CVS district management. This policy is Selig’s, not theirs. I have concluded that It is not about “private property” or helping the businesses it reputedly benefits. Its a predatory arrangement that generates profit for Selig. Other cities have tackled this kind of predatory parking enforcement. I no longer shop in this center because, even though I have never parked there and left the lot, I am not impressed that it would be a matter of the enforcer’s word against mine, and that he holds the key to the boot. I also find it doesn’t make for a happy shopping experience to see unhappy people waiting to have boots removed from their cars. Yet again, the happy “isn’t it wunnerful” groupthink is contradicted by the actual experience of living in Decatur.
For years Selig off and on hired a security guard to chase off non-shoppers at Commerce Plaza and at most severe sticker a window. It didn’t work. There are about 643 warning signs on the property now. Private property. Even when you just leave the lot for “just a few minutes” you could be taking a place somebody needs just to drop off their shirts at the cleaners. At least Bruce Cohen has relinquished his title of Decatur Parking Demon to Selig now.
Okay, I checked this out with Selig. The booting program was authorized after a polling of several of the key businesses who all agreed that parking was an issue. Since it’s been implemented, the property manager has received positive feedback from some businesses (and a couple of longtime customers). Selig does not make money from it and pays for the attendant to be on site. Selig accepts that they’re going to be tagged as bad/evil… or Demon (really??), but is okay with it as long as there will be parking for their tenants.
And now I’m not wanting to shop there because I think the businesses are acting like wusses! They could easily take care of eliminating bad experiences for their customers by displaying a sign that says something like: “To ensure parking spaces for our valued customers, Commerce Square parking is rigidly enforced.”
What do the signs that are there now say?
What I meant is that the businesses should come up with a sign to display in their businesses (or maybe a door or window decal) that nicely lets their customers know that parking is for Commerce Square only.
(No clue what the posted signs say, but since the complaints aren’t that the signs are misleading, they must pass muster.)
This discussion got me so curious, that when I was out this evening, I drove by to look at the signs. I’m pretty astounded by several things. First of all, signs are truly everywhere and readable even from the car. And yet, I have no memory of ever seeing them before. Were they installed recently, like in the last two months? If not, then my theory is that it’s us local long-time residents who are likely to be booted, not so much visitors, because we are so used to how things have always been and always looked that the new signs don’t even permeate our consciousness.
Another observation is that the majority of the signs look like historic markers rather than like warnings. That’s good for aesthetics but maybe is why some of us have overlooked the signs? In fact the top of each sign is titled in big lettering, centered:
WELCOME
COMMERCE SQUARE
Besides leaving out the “TO” as in “WELCOME TO COMMERCE SQUARE, the friendly tone of the title belies the message below in smaller lettering and dense text: “Unauthorized vehicles may be impounded (Booted) using a mechanical locking device at owner’s risk and expense. The Maximum Removal Fee Per Day (24 hours) is $95. Fee payable by debt card, cash, credit card or check | CPS, 3330 Cumberland Boulevard, Suite 500, Atlanta, GA 30329 | 877-799-7270”. (The weird capitalization is the sign’s, not mine.) My favorite parts are that the sign welcomes the Square, not shoppers, and that it bothers to define a day as 24 hours. Meanwhile it doesn’t explain that parkers may not leave Commerce Square even if they mostly patronized Commerce Square businesses.
In addition, there ARE clear, less wordy signs with larger font, one for each entrance to the lot. They say:
“Customer Parking Only
If you leave the property and you do not take your vehicle with you, it will be towed or booted. GA code 44-1-13”
These signs are clear and describe the situation. They could be more succinct but they pretty much tell the story. Again, why are residents not noticing them and then getting booted?
The whole time I was in my car recording the wording of the signs, I got the heebie jeebies wondering whether the booter was going to come up to my window and challenge me. While I had not left the lot without taking my vehicle with me, I had a feeling that it might be considered an “unauthorized vehicle”.
I drove by Commerce Square today too, and had the exact same thought. The signs really do look like historic markers! (Which, now that I think of it, is bizarre considering it’s a generic strip mall). I patronize business in Emory Village all the time and their signs look like your typical big-city warning signs. BRIEF warnings in huge letters posted at each parking spot. Just like you would expect.
The booting isn’t about prevention and keeping spaces open; it’s about making money off of people who have already transgressed whether willfully or in error. Otherwise, the booting company wouldn’t be in business. It needs to have constant supply of new parkers who don’t think they will be booted in order to make money.
What do the signs actually say? (Since I no longer park there, I haven’t read them.) Do they indicate that you cannot leave the lot even if you shopped legitimately at one of the Plaza businesses? Are they in small print and legalese or do they plainly say something in huge, eye-catching print like “If You Leave Plaza, Your Car Will be Booted”. I think parkers innocently believe that the parking is for patronizing the Plaza’s businesses so it is okay to leave the lot for awhile if one has shopped at the businesses. I’d rather have meters at the lot. Can the City buy it? With meters, it’s clear that you have to pay and it’s clear how long you can park.
The City cannot supply meters – it’s private property.
That’s why I wondered if the City could buy it. I know probably not. But that’s why, if I absolutely can’t boycott shopping at the Plaza, I’ll park in the metered spaces on Ponce rather than in the parking lot. When you pay a meter, you aren’t promising where you will shop. The small price is worth avoiding an expensive boot.
The City is not going to get into the business of owning and operating surface parking lots and I’m sure that the asking price would be extreme top dollar anyway.
I think a pay parking lot with validation is a very civilized solution to their problem. I pay to park all the time in other parts of metro Atlanta.
With Twist and Scoot in Decatur gone, does anyone have a rec for scooter maintenance? I know there is another Twist and Scoot on Piedmont, but its hard to safely and legally get my 35 mph speed limit.
Atlanta Motorcycle on Memorial, just past Moreland (ATLmotorcycles dot net). They used to be on Ponce and can fix nearly any scooter. We have been very happy with them for several years now and have put >5000 miles on a scooter.
There’s a scooter/motorcycle repair shop on Ponce (in Atlanta), across from Murder Kroger, at the corner of Ponce and Ponce Place (the Ponce Place in Atlanta, not the one in Decatur).
That location closed, they moved to Memorial.
Thanks for confirming that. I thought I noticed they closed a couple of months ago.
Gracie and I were walking through Glenlake Park this evening when a former student of mine yelled “Mr. B”. Even though I hadn’t seen Andrew Johnson in more that twenty years, I recognized him immediately. His sister Deseree later joined us and and we talked about DHS in the 1980s. He pointed out his parents near the pavilion, all part of a large family reunion in the park. After some small talk, Deseree asked, “Did you hear about Scott Bowman?”
Scott was one of the first kids I bonded with at DHS. He was a freshman in one of my classes in 1978 but more important, Scott was a member of one of my first b-team basketball teams at Decatur. People today may not understand what a big deal this was back in the day but being a part of Decatur basketball in the late Seventies/early Eighties was like being part of the most important high school sports fraternity in Georgia. Legendary coach Bob Reinhart and his assistant coach Carter Wilson were building a national powerhouse and Scott and I were part of it.
In 1981-82, Scott was a starter on the DHS basketball team ranked number two in the nation and riding a 50 game winning streak. The team had some great players, All-American Melvin “Hollywood” Howard, Darrell Gresham, Travis Benton, Michael Covington and Scott. As I recall, we were playing a City of Atlanta school in the quarterfinals of the state tournament somewhere in Marietta. The gym was packed with screaming fans from Decatur and Atlanta, so much so that the gym security had to keep fans with nowhere to sit from standing too close to the court. The game was close throughout until the last thirty seconds. We had the ball with a one point lead. All we had to do was run out the clock. Howard had the ball at the top of the key. Pass to Benton who looked at the basket and threw back to Howard. He juked left and right before passing to Gresham on the right wing. Scott was low on the block and stepped out ten feet on the baseline. Gresham passed to Scott. He caught the ball, squared up to the basket and shot. The gym went silent! I can still see it now, the ball bouncing off the rim and the City of Atlanta team rebounding, scoring and wining the game by one point. We were crushed. The locker room was like a morgue for a teenager who had just died in a tragic automobile accident. And there at the end of the bench was Scott Bowman, face in his hands, crying like a baby. We all were.
But Scott’s life did not end in that locker room. He graduated from DHS and went on to play college football in California. I was told that he could have played pro ball but instead, returned home to Decatur and with a degree in criminal justice and joined the DeKalb County sheriffs department where he worked for thirty years until he recently retired. For years, when I would take my students on tours of the DeKalb County jail or the courthouse, I would ask the deputy in charge about Scott Bowman. They would speak of Scott as if he were a legend. I recall one tour of the jail when the deputy in charge, a small thin white man, described how Scott taught him how to walk the halls without fear. And it showed. All the inmates, no mater how tall or mean looking, respected this deputy. The students and I felt safe throughout the tour no doubt because of the influence Scott had on the deputy.
Scott was a man who had a deep faith. Even as a student at DHS, he was willing to tell other students, teachers and coaches about how his Christian faith had changed his life. Little did I know at the time how critical this would be. Scott’s mother, Hattie Bowman, a long time employee at Refroe Middle School was murdered shortly after he graduated from college. I was told that Scott struggled with a weight problem as an adult. But throughout all of Scott’s ups and downs, his faith kept him strong.
Many of you who are reading this may think that Decatur High’s greatness began with Dr. Edwards but years ago, when Decatur High was majority black, we had outstanding students and athletes. Scott Bowman was one of them. I will always regret that I didn’t take the time to meet him and reminisce about the old days. I would have told him how proud I was to have been part of his life. And that missed shot? That was nothing compared to the positive influence he had on so many others. Rest In Peace Scott. God Speed.
http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/atlanta/obituary.aspx?n=sgt-scott-bowman&pid=175282177&
Very nice tribute. Thank you for sharing.
Lovely tribute. That was one of the two or three greatest high school teams ever assembled in the state of Georgia, and my alma mater (Chamblee) had the misfortune of having to play them twice a year. They whipped us so bad in one of those games that the final score (108-17 or some such) was the headline of the Atlanta Constitution’s sports section the next morning.
That is wonderful, Mr. B. Thanks for sharing. RIP Scott. Go Bulldogs.
Thank you for the lovely tribute, Mr B. Scott was a colleague of mine, and all of us at DKSO were terribly saddened at his passing. He was a kind and generous person, and will be much missed.