Annexation Clarification: You Pay For The School Your Kids Attend
Decatur Metro | December 22, 2014 | 8:30 amOne item referenced by both the city and CSD during the recent Annexation Master Plan approval, specified that city schools wouldn’t need to provide educational services to students in the annexed areas until 18 months after the effective annexation date.
This has led to a few comments here in the last week where folks have worried that any such delay in adding students to the City Schools of Decatur school system would mean that they would be paying Decatur school taxes, while continuing to send their kids to DeKalb County Schools.
So I followed up with Decatur City Manager Peggy Merriss, who verified that this wasn’t the case. She writes…
As I understand it, taxpayers would continue to pay property taxes to the appropriate school system where they are enrolled.
For example, if the annexation was effective on December 31, 2015, then for school year beginning July 1, 2016 students in the annexation area would continue to attend DeKalb County schools and taxpayers would pay DeKalb County school taxes in two installments in 2016 (usually due in late August and mid November). For school year beginning July 1, 2017, students in the annexation area would attend City Schools of Decatur and taxpayers would pay Decatur School taxes in two installments in 2017 (usually due June 1st and December 20th).
So taxes would be paid to the school system for the school year where the children are enrolled.
I hope that clarifies things a bit.
For every student the city is taking more than $8500 in ad valorem taxes away from DeKalb County Schools. Shifting thousands that are currently used to fund Medlock children’s education. What will DeKalb need to cut to make sure Decatur’s children aren’t burdened? DeKalb County legislators should stop this from occurring.
Apologies if I misunderstand the argument, but isnt the money just following the student? I don’t envy DeKalb’s position in the larger scheme of things, but in this specific example if that’s the case, how is $ following the student an extra burden on DeKalb? How are the ad velourum taxes used currently and where do they go if the students are transferred to Decatur? Maybe that would help start to clarify things.
If Decatur were taking the students who currently depend on the funding, then the shift would not be as significant. Decatur only collects $5,700 in ad valorem taxes for each student from their own citizens, yet purposely minimizing residences in the annexation and permanently disrupts the current balance used to fund Medlock’s children’s education. This shifts funding requirements to other parts of the county (north and south Dekalb). If Decatur moved Medlock’s students along with the taxes, then a more equitable transfer would occur and in-line with existing funding formulas. Steve, the ad valorem taxes are the local part of the total formula used to fund education. This amount does not include state or federal. No one has really done the research so it is hard to tell the final impact on Dekalb schools from all these annexations. One thing is true without reviewing one calculation – Dekalb schools lose and Medlock area children really lose to Decatur’s greed.
Thanks for the clarification.
DeKalb schools aren’t going to specifically de-fund Medlock children because Decatur has annexed property. Actually, any annexation by Decatur or Atlanta (think the TIA initiative with the Druid Hills community) will reduce the tax digest for DeKalb schools since those cities have their own school system and annexed properties will (eventually) cease paying DeKalb school taxes and begin paying taxes to the school system of the city where they have been annexed. But that reduction will be spread across the entire DeKalb school system. It won’t be taken specifically from the Medlock community.
If I were you, I would be a lot more concerned about TIA’s Atlanta annexation efforts, since it will effectively divorce Medlock (and Avondale) from the Druid Hills HS Cluster. I think that item actually has the bigger impact on the quality of education for Medlock and Avondale residents. Druid Hills is one of the better-performing DeKalb school clusters… the other clusters in the area (which Medlock and Avondale will necessarily have to be shifted to) have much worse performing schools in them.
The vitriol spewed forth by MANA regarding Decatur’s annexation of adjacent commercial properties is consistent, but the logic behind it is flawed. If anything, MANA would have a better message if it widened its criticism to TIA as well for the same reasons. But even so, based on its own points, all DeKalb citizens outside of the Decatur and Atlanta city limits have the same point regarding any annexation in DeKalb County by either Decatur or Atlanta.
To be fair, vitriol has spewed in every direction, and no I don’t live in Medlock Park, but I think people are just seeing what they want to see here. Was it even 2 years ago Mayor Floyd was speaking at the Walmart Sucks post-parade rally in the Square and now everyone can’t wait to cash these evil-doers checks? If you want to see vitriol read the Walmart posts, or Parkwood posts for that matter, dare I even say the children’s home posts, then you can get a feel for what serious vitriol looks like. Btw, Presently there are 2 bed condos selling in the areas to be annexed for about 100k give or take, wait until the price jumps about 50k and the singletons bail, and families move in. And the parcels of land near Patel that weren’t previously worth much? They will suddenly become worth much more and developers will throw up more condos now that it would be financially feasible. I really don’t know how anyone can look at all this annexation without seeing all the enormous costs and strains on services that will come with it, and still see dollar signs.
Why are people ignoring there’s a really simple way to keep annexation at bay? Because most would rather see enrollments increase, standards and housing prices decrease, all to avoid a tax increase. Makes absolutely no sense.
Jon you are right – it is not simply one annexation creating the issue. It is a combined effort of cityhood and annexation. The total shift of school ad valorem tax collections will exceed $40 to $60 million per year (no one really knows) and shift more than $1.8 billion from the existing digest (no one really knows). Leaving a significantly smaller digest with virtually the same funding requirements since neither annexation takes enough students (everyone knows this). Dunwoody and Brookhaven’s commercial districts win the consolation prize (no one has told them yet) and will be required to pick up most of the loss. Complicated by the fact that DeKalb school system’s remaining digest with a 25 mill cap is simply not able to cover the current funding needs (Math 101). Yet, I would disagree with placing blame on Medlock – the vitriol (aka/ rhetoric even King George III with his tax policies would appreciate) spewed forth is rooted in Decatur’s own elected officials who vote as they simultaneously use terms such as ‘with regrets’ when pushing the yes button for policies they know harm their neighbors.
Ah ok. Thanks for clarifying! Can you just explain the greater impact on Medlock children vs. DeKalb? I’m not quite up to speed on that.
DM you ask – can you just explain the greater impact on Medlock children vs. DeKalb? The answer is no – since no one has asked the public policy question. When pursuing these legislative annexations would it not be wise to ask first what the financial losses will be on the affected school district as most other forms of annexations require? Especially when SACS has called attention to the system’s fiscal condition? The tax consequences may be irreversible. Yet the march continues without regard to the county’s remaining children.
While the $8500 figure may be on target (I haven’t done the research), not all of it is school taxes. Some is state and federal support.
And, as DM says, while the County would be getting less money, they would also be educating fewer children.
“… effective on December 31, 2015, then for school year beginning July 1, 2016 …”
I think the correct terminology is fiscal year (FY). The 2016-17 school year is FY2017 where funding is concerned. Calling it school year and using a date of July 1 which is not when school actually begins can be confusing. The 2017-18 school year is then FY2018.
Also, I see the question is about property owners with children enrolled in public schools but doesn’t this tax application date apply across the board to all properties? The switch from school tax being paid to Dekalb in FY2017 and then to Decatur in FY2018?
Good question- will follow up. I assume that everyone – including commercial – in the annexed area would pay DeKalb school taxes until students in the annexation area switched.
OK, just confirmed with the City Manager. No property owner in the annexation area would pay Decatur school taxes until students in the annexed areas began to attend Decatur schools. Prior to that, they would pay DeKalb school taxes. Hope that helps!
Check again. Just because the City Manager says something doesn’t make it law. She, unfortunately, is not the the general assembly. Unless the General Assembly says so, then under the legislative method it simply is not so.
Well sure. The legislature could mandate any number of things. But the original point of this post was to detail the city’s plan, since folks were yelling “foul!” That the city would consider bringing in property, taking school $ and still sending kids to DeKalb schools. Nothing here is set in stone needless to say. We’re only talking about intention and what’s in the plan.
The difference between other forms of annexation and the legislative form is that the legislature HAS to mandate differently. Thus, making the possibility less than likely since their intention has to pass more hurdles and overcome the traditional process. An important difference – when reporting – that most are not aware of or understand unless clarified.
Ok I getcha. Good point. Thanks!
I think they need to call it “school year” because DeKalb County’s fiscal year is calendar (January to December), while Decatur’s fiscal year is July to June.
That’s a good point as well. I was basing my scheme on state education dollars and how they relate to funding.
That’s important too. Georgia is a July to June fiscal year with a mid-year adjustment during the legislative session from January to March.
If annexation is the end of December 2015, then my kids would be attending Decatur schools after the Christmas break. Just sayin’.
Look again. Your kids wouldn’t start attending CSD schools until the new 2017/2018 school year
If legislative annexation occurs without specifically saying differently, then AMB’s children will be attending immediately following the approval of the referendum.
I did look. If I am in the city, I am in the city and my kids will attend Decatur schools.
Look again. School enrollment would be delayed if the CSD “conditions” are met.
Keep hoping for something different, but unless the legislation says differently CSD can just hope for the best since AMBs children will attend immediately following approval of the referendum.
You are still not understanding. I do not care what the agreement is or understanding or spit in your hand and shake agreement is. If I am in the city, there will be no second class treatment of my family or my children.
whatever… I forgot you appointed yourself Grand Poobah.
if you are legally accepted into the city under certain conditions, there will be no special treatment of your family or your children. the law, if it passes, is the law. if you don’t like the law, you can try to stop it, or get it changed, but you can’t expect your family to be treated as a special class of citizens that lives above the law.
There is no law. There is an “understanding” that somehow the new residents aren’t really in Decatur for another year. If a family moved into Decatur, would their children have to wait a year to go to school until the taxes caught up? Well, no. This is the start of any potential annexed residents being ‘those people’ from ‘not really Decatur’.
Hmmm. Taxes aren’t prorated when someone moves into Decatur? It’s been so long since I moved in that I can’t remember. Probably not since the Decatur tax digest hasn’t even kept up with the skyrocketing value of new and newly renovated homes.
Taxes are typically prorated between the buyer and seller at closing.
Actually, if this is approved, it will be by legislative act. In other words, law. And you won’t be paying school taxes until the later date, so there is no “catching up”. School taxes are pay as you go. Be pissed all you want, but you aren’t going to get special treatment. Nor are you going to get a free ride (not that you are demanding one).
January 2015. My child shows up at Westchester School with a gas bill from a Decatur address. And they will not be allowed to attend? Really? Because my family hasn’t kicked in enough tax money yet? How do you think that sounds? Not too warm and welcoming.
It has nothing to do with the tax money collected. It has everything to do with the schools not being able to immediately add 750 kids to an already full system.
I don’t care how it sounds. If those are the approved terms of the legislative action, those are the terms. And I think CSD is competent enough to compile a list of the new addresses that lie within the boundaries CoD, but whose children will continue attending DeKalb schools.
And it has nothing to do with kicking in enough money. Try reading up on this. Your school tax dollars will not come to CSD until your children are enrolled there. CSD will not get one penny before in advance of your children attending, and until that time, you will continue to pay school taxes to DeKalb.
And how do you think it sounds when you demand special treatment for which you won’t be paying?
So how about this to solve your overcrowding problem: pass a law that says no resident who acquired his/her Decatur residence after 1/1/15 is eligible to attend CSD without express permission of the administration, and no CSD taxes will be collected from said residents unless/until their attendance is approved. Overcrowding problem solved. There would be some fairness objections, I suppose, but they’d be little different than AMB’s, which aren’t getting a lot of sympathy here anyway.
What is unfair about not providing a service for which AMB wouldn’t be paying? And no one is denying AMB’s children access to CSD. AMB is free to buy a house within the current boundaries of CoD in which event her children could immediately be enrolled in CSD.
If it’s not unfair to exclude certain COD residents from CSD, then I guess you agree with my proposal? I take it that in your view, Decatur can single out residents to exclude from the schools so long as their tax dollars don’t go to CSD. So do it, avoid this messy annexation issue, and solve your overcrowding problem, all in one.
Alternatively, if it is unfair to single out some residents and make them ineligible for CSD, why is it OK to exclude AMB?
I think the term “effective date” applies here. It seems that nothing will be effective until MM/DD/2017. Before that, your postal Decatur address won’t offer you anything more than it does right now.
Of course you’ll be able to sell your house for $100k above what it’s worth now, without having to pay any additional taxes. Not a bad deal, eh?
Sounds like a lawsuit waiting to be filed.
Couldn’t the phase in of services be beneficial to both Dekalb County and COD? The proposal gives both municipalities time to plan and adjust for changes in the tax digest as well as the demand for their services. If I were a potential soon to be annexed neighbor I would be happy that Decatur is proposing a substantial transition period during which changes to meet the increased demand can be made. The only instance I could see an annexed family being worked up about a sensible transition plan is if one moved into an area with the expectation of annexation and feels entitled from day one of annexation to all things offered by COD regardless of where their actual tax dollars may be going. This proposal is not to short anyone or treat anyone as second class citizens but rather a well thought out transition for a significant change to our small City. If you are looking for a city with second class citizens look no further than the oasis to our east otherwise known as Avondale Estates. I have heard that they are not allowing their annexed citizens the privilege of joining the Avondale Swim Club.
The Avondale Swim and Tennis Club is a small private club where residents within a small geographic area of the city are eligible to pay an initiation fee and annual membership dues. It is not a public venue paid for with resident tax dollars. Your analogy does not apply.
“Be pissed all you want, but you aren’t going to get special treatment.”
Isn’t the law itself — assuming it is enacted as you say — what is giving AMB “special treatment,” i.e., specifying a special and very small subset of Decatur residents who are ineligible to use the schools? It seems to me that AMB is asking to be treated as any other Decatur resident if she’s annexed.
Thank you.
CSD is asking for 18 months to get ready to handle an additional 750 students that annexation will immediately provide. There are not enough rooms, desks or teachers to service all of the additional students. Furthermore, AMB and other new residents will not be providing taxes for the Decatur schools during those 18 months. I understand that AMB wants what he/she wants when he/she wants it, but it simply isn’t feasible for the schools to provide those services immediately.
Yet Decatur annexed them anyway. And see my post above re: treating ALL new residents the way the newly annexed residents will be treated. Why not do it?
Why not? CSD is required by state law to provide a desk for each child, so CSD can’t unilaterally decide to deny enrollment. The obvious exception to this requirement would be a state law delaying this requirement. Fair or unfair, CSD doesn’t have a magic wand or a genie in a bottle or anything else which will magically create the space and resources to educate another 750 students.
First off, no one has been annexed yet and I have a suspicion it won’t pass due to issues with the commercial vs residential split. So we’re really arguing a hypothetical that I believe has a less than 50% chance of passing. Second, the new residents that would be annexed already have clear schools they have been attending and would continue to service them. If someone bought a house in Oakhurst, would you want them to be home-schooled or sent out of district? It’s not an apples to apples comparison.
Point taken on the approval of this plan, but for conversation purposes I thought we were assuming approval. Otherwise there is nothing to talk about. And even if you assume the plan won’t be approved, the plan itself is a statement of what Decatur wishes to do, which can certainly be debated.
And no, it’s not apples to apples, but close enough to illustrate my point that what Decatur is doing is inherently unfair and self-serving. AMB is getting some grief for her posts here, and though she and I agree on next to nothing as a general matter, I think she’s right on this one.
I was just trying to calm tempers, but I get your point about it being assumed for this conversation to take place.
However, I don’t believe this is inherently unfair as I view it from a service standpoint. The system cannot immediately service an additional 750 students, and CSD needs time to prepare. The newly annexed individuals still are getting provided the services they are paying for via Dekalb County (and their money still goes to those schools, not CSD). No one is being denied service – it’s just not immediately their desired provider.
We may just have to agree to disagree on this one.
because annexation is a question of residences more than residents. nobody is getting annexed into decatur. some people’s property might be getting annexed. and that property will get annexed using some sort of agreement that will determine how those properties get rolled into the city. it will be agreed to, in some way or another, but the city and the owners of the property, and it will be law. if someone thinks that law is unfair, there are avenues to pursue to stop it. unfortunately for those people, i doubt the “but we both live in decatur, why can’t my kid go to the school too? i don’t care what the law says, it’s not fair.” argument holds much water. it’s a little more complicated than that.
feel free to prove me wrong though, for if things go through, i’ll also have a new shiny city of decatur gas bill and would love some better schooling for the kids.
It may well become law at Decatur’s urging. That would hardly make it fair. If it does become law, then I agree — no amount of pleading at the school house door is going to make any difference, any more than my pleading with the IRS will lower my tax bill. That’s a separate question from whether the law itself is equitable.
if the annexing city and the annexed properties’ owners agree to it, with the blessing of the state legislature, in what way is it not fair? it might not be what a particular person living in property annexed would want in a perfect world, and if that’s not fair, well, life’s not fair. is it fair that some kids will get to go to CSD after a short delay, while others living just down the road will never get to do so? what is fair is that the property owners of the annexed property get to say yes or no to the proposal the city makes them, and if they, as a group, find it fair, what can you do?
i would say there would be a law (if it all passes through the legislature), and possibly there is a lack of understanding here as well.
AMB is correct. The legislation will have to spell out the time periods involved. Students could be shifted from Druid Hills High School feeder school, then to another school, then finally to Decatur unless the general assembly spells out the legislative intent of all the annexations. Sounds like a fun school experience.
You can ride the bus but you have to sit in the back.
I think he/she’s saying that they will throw a colossal fit complete with media attention and legal action. But I assume that it’s only if he/she has to pay Decatur taxes as of that date. If Decatur taxes are delayed, then new residents will probably be ok with attending their current schools. I can’t blame anyone for being annoyed if they had to pay Decatur taxes without the privilege of attending CSD, but it sounds like DM checked that out and that scenario won’t happen.
The Grandest to you.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t annexation require “homerule” approval, i.e. a majority of the DeKalb legislation delegation to vote for it? Annexation is far from a done deal.
Yes
Doesn’t it also require approval by some preset percentage of the residents to be annexed?
60%, I believe.
I think it’s 60% by resident’s petition, but only simple majority if the city initiates the action. I stand to be corrected if I am wrong.
Unfortunately Decatur’s approach to annexation has doomed it to fail. Legislators aren’t going to touch this with a 10 foot pole or risk alienating a large percentage of their constituents. Not to mention the majority of commercial land owners within the annexation area strongly oppose annexation into Decatur, so a referendum will almost certainly fail. If it is an option to delay admitting newly annexed students, then Decatur should have annexed more residential and delayed taking on new students to allow new schools to be built, etc. More residential equals more votes in favor of annexation. Plus, at least then Decatur’s annexation wouldn’t have the appearance of a greedy land grab. And we are supposed to be a compassionate city. Our city leaders have failed us on this one.
I thought I recalled reading that commercial property owners don’t get to vote on annexation, only residential.
But I would tend to think that the legislators generally have more to lose by voting “yes” than they do “no,” especially since it will be so easy to label this proposal as a naked revenue grab at the expense of the larger county.
I just can’t imagine a majority of the DeKalb delegation voting for this.
“I thought I recalled reading that commercial property owners don’t get to vote on annexation, only residential.”
You recall correctly.
I believe all registered voters who reside within the proposed area can vote, whether they own property or not. Legislators are highly unlikely to propose annexations efforts over objections by property owners though, even if they ultimately would not be able to vote in a referendum.
I’m curious…..if Decatur can’t handle 750 kids on Jan. 1, 2016 (because of money issues or space issues or just because Decatur seems horrifically greedy and just claims it can’t), what makes two years from then so feasible? Apparently CSD won’t get any money during the delay so what difference does two years make? Or, what I really believe, Decatur is executing a money and land grab taking majority commercial–which gets NO vote–and a smattering of residential which, by all reports, is so small that it is very likely to lead to failure of the whole thing. If Decatur wanted to accept the newbie students on day 1, they should just annex in nov. 17, to take effect in 2018. Or–and I know this is a tremendous thing to ask–be honest about the intentions. It is what we ask of our kids and it is what we should demand of our leaders.
1. It’s true CSD will not receive money during the delay and will have to build out. Therefore, CSD has to raise the money to get desks and probably trailers since our schools were already at capacity. That takes time.
2. CSD has to work with planners to expand both short-term and long-term. Expansion plans to the schools have been in the works for a couple of years. Do they need to be revisited for short-term and long-term growth? That takes time.
3. CSD has to figure out how many students are entering, which grades they’ll be attending, and how many teachers they’ll need to hire. They then need to hire these teachers. That takes time.
This is not a large school system, and adding 750 people immediately isn’t going to happen without significant preparation. CSD is asking for time to do just that. I don’t see how you think this is as easy as snapping your fingers and making it happen. It’s not like one additional person is showing up for a pot-luck dinner. You clearly disapprove of the annexation, and that’s fine. As a Decatur resident I don’t like it, either. We can have a rational discussion about it without comparing people to children.
1) I agree it takes time. If it does, they don’t need to annex now unless they are unequivocally dependent on the new commercial for the funds. If they are, they are sunk before they start.
2) I agree it takes time. If it does, they don’t need to annex now. They can annex later when they have taken all the time they want to plan. They aren’t and we all know why.
3) I agree they should figure that out but that doesn’t mean they need to annex now…..when the demographics three years from now may be different. Having written that, it is a tad naive to believe or insist upon a nearly perfect student to be inventory in order to bring the new residential area in. The realities of schools are that teachers are certified in early, middle and high school grades, meaning that a fourth grade teacher could teach sixth grade and a third grade teacher could teach first grade. It may not be ideal but it is the way it works.
I don’t believe that it is snap your fingers proposal….but my point is that Decatur is annexing earlier than they need to and it is disingenuous. If they need time as you suggest and I agree, then wait. They aren’t and we all know why. I don’t approve of the annexation as is. It is incredibly short-sighted and is merely kicking the can down the street for five years at best. And I guess we will have to disagree on comparing people to kids…..especially when the people act like kids.
It’s called SPLIT SHIFTS. You people sound like the facilities can only be used by one group of students. I grew up in a rapidly-developing area 50 years ago and we went to schools that were designed for half the number enrolled – the first school day started at 6:00AM and the second at noon. It lasted a couple of years. It wasn’t fun. But the bond issues for new buildings got passed. And nobody was second-class because we ALL were, for awhile. You want to annex? Then suck it up.
That would certainly solve the short-term issue and give time to address the long-term concerns. I’m sure there’d be some logistical things to work out, but nothing insurmountable.
I can’t think of a quicker way to shoot down the whole annexation than to start talking about split shifts at the schools. The idea of split shifts does not resolve the issue of needing to hire A LOT of new faculty in a short time. Indeed, it accentuates the faculty issue unless you expect our teachers to be in the classroom from 5:30 A.M. to 6:30 P.M. There are also issues and expenditures related to doubling up on transportation and who knows how many other unexpected costs. This money would be better spent on efficiently and cost effectively getting our facilities ready to welcome our new students into a school system that has had the time to properly provide them with all of the resources that are currently available to CSD kids.
There is a lot more to childhood than a 7 hour school day. Many of our current students (as well as many of the students who would be annexing into CSD) have dedicated years of tremendous effort into extracurricular activities. We have talented school athletes, artists, musicians, as well as budding scientists, engineers and leaders. We have other kids who are heavily involved and show great promise in activities that are provided outside of the school community, such at Callenwolde, Atlanta Ballet and a host of club sports. Some may consider these activities just a fun pastime. However, often, these activities lead to acceptances at selective universities, to scholarships that allow financially strapped students to attend college and even to future careers. In fact, sometimes involvement in these activities will keep an at risk student from dropping out of high school altogether. The logistics of trying to accommodate these kids’ schedules would be a nightmare. Which ones would be accommodated by getting their preferred shift? Which ones would be told, “We are sorry, but you will have to give up that activity.”
I understand why residents newly annexed into Decatur would prefer the convenience of immediately moving their kids from their existing school rather than having to wait one year so CSD can properlyprepare. However, imposing years of split shifts on 4000 other students and requiring some of our most promising artists, leaders and athletes to abandon their passions despite years of dedication and hard work seems like too high of a price to pay for a year of convenience. Folks that are in the annexed areas need to remember that their kids and their neighbors’ kids will also have to deal with split shifts. Are the existing schools in the annexed neighborhoods so bad that it’s worth all of this disruption to existing CSD students as well as the annexed students just for one extra year at a new school?
If you are curious, Google “crowded schools split shifts” and read for yourself how split shifts erode school spirit/community and even student outcomes, particularly for at risk kids.
And with all that there’s potential loss of SACS (now AdvancED) accreditation with split sessions. Kids kinda, sorta, yep really need that for college admissions.