Shots Fired at DeKalb School Just South of Decatur, No Injuries Reported
Decatur Metro | August 20, 2013From WSB…
Channel 2 Action News has confirmed that one person is in custody after shots were fired at a DeKalb County elementary school.
The DeKalb County schoolboard chairman said there was an active shooter at Ronald E. McNair Discovery Learning Academy. Channel 2 Action News has confirmed with multiple sources that the suspect is a white man in his 20s who was armed with an AK-47 and dressed in black.
City Schools of Decatur wrote this message on their Facebook page…
There is a situation at an elementary school on 2nd Avenue in DeKalb County. This school is not part of the City Schools of Decatur. You may see an increased police presence around the City. Please check your local news for more information.
If you need to get your bearings, McNair Discovery Learning Academy is located south of East Lake Golf Course. Here’s a map.
No shots were fired, suspect is in custody and all students are completely safe and have been transported to the WalMart on Gresham Road to reunite w/ their parents. This is the latest news report!
Incorrect. Shots were definitely fired. They just didn’t hit anyone. Thank God.
I recommend DM close this thread to comments in anticipation of the inevitable pro-gun/anti-gun “discussion” that goes nowhere and solves nothing.
Do you think anyone here is going to advocate carrying guns in schools by anyone other than police officers or hired security personnel?
I don’t think anything. I’m just tired of watching the same old back-and-forth.
But that would foreclose the inevitable “real Decatur vs. postal Decatur” debate and you know we’re overdue to revisit that one!
I’ve already seen at least one divisive “remember, this didn’t happen in City of Decatur” post on my FB feed. Barf.
I don’t know the context but maybe the intention was not to be dismissive but rather to inform individuals (especially parents) that this was not a COD school. Useful information if someone just read a headline that depicted the school as in Decatur.
The tone was more like, “this isn’t anything we need to worry about because it’s not in ‘our’ community.”
To be fair, every other post I’ve seen has been much more compassionate and concerned.
Meant to say divisive, not dismissive. Couldn’t get editor to work.
Did the COD schools go into “official lock-down” during the incident?
Don’t think so because I didn’t receive an automated message which is what parents usually get during a lock-down. I DID get an automated message about curriculum night though!
Considering this happened 2 miles from a COD school, I hope they review procedures and ways to communicate with other school districts/private schools during situations like this. Other Dekalb county schools farther away went into “lock-down”.
My child’s CSD teacher was completely unaware of the situation at afternoon pickup.
McNair is not in the City of Decatur. It is in the mailing district of Decatur. A point of contention for me with the news. They always make it seem like things occur in the City of.
Everything I’ve seen indicates Dekalb County, not Decatur. Not that it matters though. COD doesn’t have a protective shield around it, and this is way too close to home!
At first all the reports said “Decatur” school, since the zip code is a Decatur address. WSB and AJC all changed it to Dekalb County school after about an hour into the reporting.
When my co-worker came in to tell me there was a shooter at “a school in Decatur” I thought it would be prudent to specify whether it was a DeKalb school or COD school so I could plan my freak-out accordingly.
The zipcode is not a Decatur address. It’s postal Decatur, which means the mail for that portion of unicorporated DeKalb goes through the Decatur post stop.
And yeah, the distinction is important for some people. I had NINE texts and SIX phone calls after the WSB erroneous report from friends and relatives genuinely freaked out. Another friend of mine had family and high school friends from Alabama calling her in a panic.Heck, when I heard this report, automatically figured it was DeKalb and wasn’t worried about my own kids. That is not good either.
We should all be upset over this happening but I don’t think it is a lot to ask of REPORTERS to report the correct location to avoid unnecessary panic.
The reporters did give the correct location. The school’s address is Decatur. Y’all need to get over this. It’s not going to change until y’all change the name of the 30030 zip code to something like Real Decatur or Upscale Decatur. Build a moat while you’re at it.
First world problems.
Why do you care? You don’t live here. And no, it was NOT a Decatur school. It is a DeKalb school.That is exactly was reported early on – a shooting in a Decatur school. That is what freaked my cousin out completely. They went back and corrected the report later.
You need to worry about things in your own neighborhood. Thanks.
I worry about things in the neighborhood where I live, 30032, which the US Government has denoted as Decatur along with several other zip codes, and I worry about things in the neighborhood where I work, 30030 (and spend money in local businesses, and volunteer for local events and charities). It just really cracks me up when y’all get your panties twisted about the fact that the term Decatur refers to more than just your crime free, high academic achieving zip code that is so intent on pushing lower middle class people and the poor out of its boundaries or into public housing.
c’mon man, i like to poke fun at our snootier than thou nature as much as anyone but i don’t think this is about protecting the Decatur brand.
in the context of all the wicked school shootings we’ve had, parents with children in Decatur schools are deservedly alarmed when they hear news reports of a shooting in a “Decatur school”. it’s terrible when they happen anywhere, but parents tend to be a bit more concerned when their own children might be involved. it’s that simple.
Thanks, Rick. That is my point. I just got off the phone with my mom in Arkansas. She is chronically ill and just turned on the news for the first time today and saw that. She was hysterical.I just don’t think it is asking much to properly identify the schools. And I don’t think it is too much to ask for these incidents not to happen at all, in any school.
I also am really over people who don’t live in Decatur (and you don’t, sorry, you live in unincorporated DeKalb. If your mail suddenly gets routed to Atlanta or Lilburn, that’ll be your address) telling people in Decatur how we are supposed to think about things, run our city and run our schools. I do a lot in Midtown Atlanta and I even pay for a mailbox in Midtown that Atlanta and Fulton jury clerks keep mistaking for my house, but I don’t go chiming in and telling Midtowners how they should feel about things, since I am not invested as an actual member of the community. I am just consumer and visitor there, and I respect that.
I am dismayed that this thread about a real threat to children has turned into, yet again, “If you don’t live here in the city limits of Decatur, you have no right to say anything.” When I lived two houses outside of Decatur, I considered myself part of the community. Now that I live a couple of miles away, I don’t think of myself as part of the Decatur community per se, but I don’t see why that means I should shut up.
I eat in Decatur. I shop here. I attend cultural events. My notion of community doesn’t end with my neighborhood or subdivision. Community is where we live, work and play. We don’t all do that in the same city limits.
FM Fats is right. The school’s address is Decatur. Specify DeKalb County Schools, DeKalb police. But for heaven’s sake. Its the city on the address. There is no city — yet — of unincorporated DeKalb.
The irony is these sort of rants about the brand hurt the brand more than a reporter correctly reporting a location.
Oh, please. It is about the reporter getting it right. And if that is how YOU view community fine. I view it differently. It has nothing to do with class, but what I think is my business versus what isn’t.
Agree with Rick. Wrong time for this particular sensitivity. You definitely have a point (and I say that as a 30030 resident), but this isn’t the time to make it. When you think your children may have been shot all you want is an accurate a geographical location as possible. There are City Schools of Decatur and there are Dekalb County Schools. That’s just a fact. Confusing the two only lead to distress for parents.
“You need to worry about things in your own neighborhood. Thanks.”
really?
I was annoyed. Sorry and mea culpa. Snarky and unnecessary
These comments by Nellie just reaffirm all of what I believe about this city. I live in Decatur, and my son goes to DHS. As soon as he graduates, I’m outta here. I’m tired of all of the smug Decaturites who think they know more than everyone else – particularly when it comes to the issue of how to govern a city. Despite what all “true decaturites” may profess from attop their ivory towers, this place is no better than any of the surrounding neighborhoods. It is riddled with crime, poor city planning, and floundering businesses. And, frankly, downtown Decatur is ugly. Moreover, in my experience, the people here are only welcoming to their own kind. And, as offensive as it may be, I am apparently allowed to state that opinion because I live here.
It’s a huge problem, Fats. Reporting something as “shooter at Decatur school” immediately made me think that there was a shooter at one of the City of Decatur schools. It’s bad reporting, and that’s all there is to it. Those reporters know the difference between the City of and the mailing district.
Bulldog, how would you have felt if it had happened at Friends School of Atlanta or The Waldorf School and it was described as “an incident at a Decatur school” on the news? Relief that it was at a private school and not at a CSD facility? Both schools are within Decatur city limits and would be legitimately described as Decatur schools in the media. This whole “when somebody hears something happened in Decatur on the news and freaks out” argument is specious IMHO. When I heard it today I waited for the school to be identified, and then I freaked out, because I have several connections to McNair. I would have been just as freaked out if something had happened at a CSD school because I know families there as well.
Again, I would have been just as freaked out. You’re trying to turn this into class warfare or something and all people wanted to know was where this shooting happened. Calling it “a Decatur school” was simply inaccurate and indicated a CSD school when that was not true. The point is they screwed up the initial reporting and worried the wrong group of people (and left the right group of people in the dark).
I beg to differ. I did not start the whole “Decatur/Not Decatur” thing here. I pointed out that that some folks had taken advantage of a horrible event and this DM thread to start the whole debate again. I really don’t give a flip what my address is. I chose to live where I live, and the address I was given when I bought my home was “Decatur”. If for some reason the name of my “town” was changed, fine. I’d deal with it. It really doesn’t matter to me. You just can’t convince me that the many of the folks who object to the delineation of anything outside the city limits as Decatur are concerned about anything more than their property values. Anybody buying a home in DeKalb County who doesn’t know the difference between City of Decatur and the unincorporated sections of DeKalb called Decatur is either an idiot or has been horribly misguided by a real estate agent.
Exactly. Thank you!
My zip is 30030, and I don’t live in the city of Decatur.
Kind of ironic that you accuse us of having “first world problems” while castigating us for thinking that we live in a different community than you.
This school is as close to 30030 as some of the CSD schools are to each other. Why would someone in Oakhurst (for example) be less concerned about this just because it’s in a different district? Are you saying you would have a different freakout if your kid was at one CSD school and this happened at another CSD school? I don’t get that.
Um, I would freak out more if it happened at Clairemont and not Oakhurst. It would involve MY kid. I am sad for other peoples’ kids having to experience this garbage, but yes, it would upset me more if my kid was the one who was going to have to deal with the aftermath.
Should have said I would freak out LESS if it happened at Clairemont and not Oakhurst, where my kids are. Editor not working.
Thanks for the clarification. I was trying to figure out if people were saying “I would be more concerned if this happened in CoD, whether or not it was my child’s school,” for some reason I didn’t understand.
Umm, yeah, my freak out would change from “god, that’s horrible, I hope everyone is safe,” to ” I have to go NOW!!”
The address is listed as 2nd ave. Decatur, GA 30032. So the news were right, and wrong that it is a school In Decatur, but not a Decatur school.
And if you look on Google maps, you can see the rest of Fayetteville Road right near Second, just like it is in Decatur. My neighbor, who doesn’t have kids, had a heart attack because someone told her it was at school near Second and Fayetteville in Decatur!
Here’s why I find so much of this specious. Suppose there was an incident at Friends School of Atlanta, St. Thomas More, or the Waldorf School, all within the city borders as are other private schools. They all would likely be described in news reports as Decatur schools, right? So are you telling me that anyone hearing this on CNN or local news would be less freaked out than hearing about an incident at a school in “Decatur that isn’t Decatur”?
I apologize for what is essentially a double comment. It was due to a router issue.
Again, why do you care so much? It really isn’t any of your business how people in Decatur feel about this.And yeah, you are the one turning into something, because many of us who actually live in Decatur were freaked out or had relatives and friends really upset that our kids might be in danger because of bad reporting. We have a right to express that. Back off and let it go. Again, not your issue, not your problem. It’s ours and we have the right to be annoyed.
By your logic, nobody here cares if your relatives and/or friends were “really upset” or sent “NINE texts and SIX phone calls” due to “bad reporting.” Unless those relatives or friends live within the Decatur city limits I guess.
I am vaguely reminded of this brilliant Onion piece:
http://www.theonion.com/video/millions-irrationally-feared-dead-in-minor-train-a,20901/
this happened outside of “decatur”, so should the issue, by your standards, not be the problem of people outside of decatur, as opposed to yours?
or is the by some standards incorrect usage of decatur by a reporter the bigger issue here?
OK, Nellie, let’s say the news reports had left out “Decatur” altogether in the initial bulletins and simply identified the site of this unfolding incident as “a Dekalb County elementary school.” That would have opened up the possibility of it being at any of 70-80 (?) public schools (and I have no idea how many private ones) situated from Doraville to Lithonia. If you want to talk about alarming people unnecessarily, tell me how that would have been better.
As someone already noted, “Decatur” has been widely understood to refer to a broad swath of the east side of the metro area for a lot of decades–far, far longer than any of us have been keeping house on our own. News reports are targeted to audiences across northern Georgia. People in Cumming don’t care whether something happens inside or outside Decatur’s precious city limit–they are interested in knowing it was in Decatur as opposed to Norcross or East Point. As for friends and relatives who might panic on hearing about something occurring “in Decatur” — help them understand (1) how densely populated the metro area is, (2) that Decatur postal addresses cover a wide swath of territory, and (3) that it’s better not to get too upset until facts are known.
I lived in Decatur for 14 years, just a few hundred feet inside the city limit. When I bought my house, I was completely oblivious to what the implications might be of living in Decatur vs Atlanta vs unincorporated Dekalb. Turned out I got to enjoy great city services & public safety and pay ever-increasing taxes that eventually forced me to move. Meanwhile, I considered my neighborhood and my community to be the people who lived within a certain radius of me in all directions. In many ways, I had more common ground with neighbors in Kirkwood and East Lake than with people in Winnona Park and the north side of Decatur. That was especially true early on, when the north and south sides of Decatur had a tendency to keep to themselves. (Whatever good or bad resulted from reconfiguring the elementary schools, getting more families going back and forth across the tracks at earlier ages definitely had a unifying effect on the city as a whole.) What I’m trying to say is that the city limit has its uses and reasons for existing. But IMO it has little if anything to do with the human dimensions of neighborhood and community.
Yes. What she said. And in a much more reasoned and neighborly way than I would have.
brava. Thank you.
Well said. Thanks.
“What I’m trying to say is that the city limit has its uses and reasons for existing. But IMO it has little if anything to do with the human dimensions of neighborhood and community.”
This, my friends, should be the gold standard response whenever the postal/COD meme rears its gnarly head from here forward.
smalltowngal, thanks for this.
STG, I don’t disagree. Community is not a simple geographic boundary.
I just get really, really annoyed at the arrogance of people who think they have a right to tell me and others how we should feel about an issue and how we should just deal with it because we are the jerks because we dare to have a different opinion and we live in Decatur. It happens ALL the time on here and it is wrong and it gets old.
I also get tired of people who think they have a right because they eat at restaurants or shop at Decatur stores to tell us how to do things. The fact of the matter is that civic boundaries and shared things like schools and taxes, etc., do matter and do create a particular type of community. If you don’t live in those boundaries then you really can’t be part of that because your interests are different and your votes just don’t count in that circumstance. Opinions are great but how often are they given with grace versus snark?
It’s not a matter of being exclusionary, but local issue like our schools and zoning laws and how we protect are trees and what we call ourselves are OUR decisions. That doesn’t mean others are not part of the community at large and aren’t needed (hell no). The larger community should be taken into account in certain decisions, but the decisions we and our leadership make as residents are at the end of the day those that benefit Decatur and hopefully do the most good/least harm for our region and our neighbors.
This all came out ugly in the annexation discussions. Certain people just said horrible, snarky thing about Decatur city government – many of which were backed up by little more than an opinion. It’s not necessary but we are for some reason expected to just take it because we live in CoD.
I got my back up. I admit it. But I have lived here 25 years and maybe I am a little protective. I just wish there could be a little understanding as to why some parents were upset rather than immediate name-calling.
STG, if you want to chat more and catch up, email me.
In the immortal words of Kinky Friedman, mucous garcias, Smallsie. BTW, I spoke to a print journalist today who told me the rule of thumb for reporting location is to use the zip code.
So you know I think you are often funny as hell and I was being completely defensive and over sensitive towards you because I didn’t feel like I could express myself at all in way that wouldn’t tick off people and was just getting all twisted up. Right? And I that I am still just not able to a make a point on anything right now at all?
Since I can’t for some reason directly reply to Ms. 1197’s comment, I’ll put it here.
In the immortal words of Curly Howard, Why, soitanly!
SMG, you put the rest of us to shame!!
Sarah Michelle Gellar????? Where?
Second Avenue is still closed. Fox 5 is reporting DeKalb SWAT activity in the neighborhood. Not complaining, but I can’t get to my Not City of Decatur home. If anyone wonders about the guy at the East Lake Y on the machines in his street clothes, there’s your answer. Oh, and the jerks who are taking this as a chance to gripe about the address issue, go do something anatomically impossible to yourselves.
Not clear if the SWAT is related, but reports that entire neighborhood is being evacuated.
The SWAT team is north of the school on Lilac Lane at the suspect’s address, reportedly with a search warrant. There are still choppers over the neighborhood. I was able to approach my home via Tilson around 5:30, and I think 2nd was open from Flat Shoals north towards the school.
Are they at the guy’s house?
Why did you not ask for a helicopter ride from the SWAT guys?
Careful, don’t try humor in this thread. Apparently it will be unceremoniously deleted. Walmart jokes bad, inane Yes-it’s-Decatur-no-it’s-not is okay. Good to know.
I still think she should have asked. She is actually pretty funny and might have gotten a lift.
Pretty silly DM deleted the Walmart comments. We. All. Must. Be. Serious. Anytime. Something. Bad. Happens. Even. If. No. One. Was. Injured. Buy, hey, it’s his blog.
There was a bomb threat at a Decatur school last week, and when someone joked about it he was immediately taken to task. How is this different?
Don’t think it is, and I didn’t have a problem with it then.
DM’s probably a Walmart shareholder.
And to think I went with the toned down joke.
Sad that pretty much the only thing that could redirect the spotlight from the Sneiderman sentencing is a school shooting.
FYI, you can access an operable edit window on a Mac by control/clicking the “click to edit” link and selecting “open link in a new tab”
i’m sure there’s an analogous function on PCs
I’m glad no one was hurt. I am sick of crazy people being able to easily access weapons like an AK-47. Not saying laws, regulations would prevent it from ever happening again. But I’m willing to bet good money this guy was under some kind of psychiatric care and yet was able to obtain this gun legally. People who think this is OK mystify me.
One of the charges is possession of a firearm by a convicted felon. He did not obtain the gun legally.
Interesting. I saw that charge when I checked AJC this a.m., but no one seems to know what he was convicted of. Just says he was once arrested in Henry County, doesn’t say he was convicted. If you have a link can you post? If I’m wrong, I’m wrong, but I’d like to know more about the circumstances. Thank you.
So, let me get this straight. You make an unbased assertion (a/k/a wild guess) in order to prove some point about gun control, Robert then points out a fact which tends to disprove your assertion, and now the burden is on Robert to go look up his record. If he was charged with possession by a “convicted felon”, either the cops were wrong and the charges will be dropped or he is a convicted felon. But, I will take your bet – $100 sound good?
His conviction was recent, so it’s quite possible that he obtained the gun legally but was in possession of it illegally. A common circumstance, as any probation officer will tell you.
It’s not a wild guess, in light of recent school shootings. In most of those cases, the weapons were obtained legally.
Probability would suggest that was the case here, but like I said, if I’m wrong I’ll admit I’m wrong. I still think we need to do more to keep AK-47 and other weapons like it away from people like this. We’ll just have to disagree on that point.
I’d also like to know if he was under psychiatric care of any sort. If he was previously charged, it seems likely he would be in contact with a mental health professional. Could be wrong about that, too. But it would be relevant information.
“It’s not a wild guess, in light of recent school shootings. In most of those cases, the weapons were obtained legally”
Not sure about that. The Sandy Hook shooter did not purchase any guns, his mom did. He then took them without authorization and used them to kill the owner of the guns. He essentially stole the guns. He could not have legally purchased them himself.
In Columbine, several of the guns were sold through illegal straw purchases.
In the case of the Va Tech shootings, I believe that the sales would have been illegal but for gaps in state and federal record keeping. (Cho would have been considered mentally defenctive at the time of his purchases but it was not reflected in the background check.)
There may be other cases where the shooters obtained the guns legally, but in several cases, they were not.
Isn’t a real AK-47 fully automatic and illegal? I believe so. It may be that you can build a fully automatic version yourself, illegally, but I don’t think it is possible to legally purchase a true AK-47.
Most AK’s legally sold today are not fully automatic. They are semi-automatic, which means you have to pull the trigger for each round. Also, it is much harder these days to modify an AR or an AK to full auto.
Technically, a true AK-47 is a select fire weapon, capable of semi-automatic and fully automatic fire. But unlike the semi-auto M16 variants that are typically designated as AR, the AK platform doesn’t have a common designator for a semi-auto only variant. Almost every AK-47 in this country is a semi-auto only.
When someone says ‘AK-47′, it’s much more of a reference to the visual look and piston based operation. It’s a ubiquitous term.
And for the record, fully automatic weapons, i.e. machine guns, are not illegal and can be purchased and owned. There’s just a little more paper work, a couple extra hoops to be jumped through, and a $200 tax payment.
Once again, this site disgusts me. Decatur (30032 etc) has been Decatur longer than you all have probably lived here. The people who live there say they are from Decatur or the East Side. When most people think of Decatur, they aren’t thinking City of Decatur. Just because you sit around getting freaked out at everything on the news, don’t try to police who can or can’t call their location Decatur. I really want to go off right now but I’ll refrain. I bet some folks were watching the news like “OH MY GOD, is it CITY of Decatur or…. oh, wait, it’s just McNair…let me go post about my ‘emotional trauma’ from this experience on a message board.”
Yeah, I would have thought that this summer’s crime wave would have put to rest notions that criminals give a damn about (or even are cognizant of) city limits or zip codes.
Specific to school shootings, people need to remember that Sandy Hook Elementary School was a good school in a small, friendly town. Contrary to what some people in my life have suggested, CoD is not immune to this.
Never posted a link before so hope this works. If not it’s the largest font link on the top of ajc.com.
http://www.ajc.com/news/news/breaking-news/shooter-arrested-at-dekalb-elementary-school/nZTSd/
Article quote:
“He was charged with aggravated assault on a police officer, terroristic threats and possession of a firearm by a convicted felon, police said.”
In perusing the postings on this subject I start to wonder: Beyond the initial enumeration of such events, why don’t we refrain from giving the same info available from multiple news sources. We should absolutely discuss opinions or knowledge someone may hold uniquely.
According to the article in AJC, McNair’s book keeper showed real presense of mind which saved the day. I am so glad nobody was hurt. It looks like the DeKalb Police handled the situation pretty well too. I don’t care what the zip code is, the children, parents, and teachers involved are our neighbors. Thank goodness they are all safe today.
+1
Thank you for this.
Yeah. This above all.
From the AJC news report, it sounds like the school bookkeeper was instrumental in talking down this disturbed person. She sounds like a hero to me. And so were all the teachers who kept their kids safely in classrooms. And probably many other staff too. IMHO, we don’t give enough respect and pay to these people who hold the lives of our children, the country’s future, in their hands every day.
There’s lessons learned, I’m sure, about school security. It’s a pain in the butt but we need to be fastidious about it. Lessons learned about guns getting into the hands of disturbed people. Lessons learned about the care of disturbed people once they are no longer minors. But we need to be thankful for the quiet heroes in our schools.
On another note: Does anyone know what the heck happened at the intersection of Briarcliff and N. Druid Hills yesterday afternoon? The entire intersection was blocked off.with no option through it.
I heard on the radio it was a gas leak.
Touche’ Robert.
How touche’? He didn’t hear about a gas leak on the radio? That was one of my guesses along with a bomb threat at Immaculate Heart of Mary or a major accident due to someone exiting Starbucks by turning left on Briarcliff.
I had made a pre-morning espresso that people refrain from posting the same info that everyone knows, and instead offer unique knowledge. I meant it at face value, as well as a subtle suggestion to drop the “Real Decatur” debate (it has exhausted itself in other threads). My post ended up sounding rather pompus; and I interpreted Robert’s comment as a justifiably smart*** response.
I had made a pre-espresso suggestion…
What is wrong with the editor?
I could tell you how to get the editor to work but that would be repeating what someone else has already said. I still can’t find anywhere in the thread where someone else pointed out the cause of the problem at Briarcliff & N. Druid Hills Rd.
Please, point out what happened North Druid Hills and Briarcliff.
I think it was a gas leak.
Don’t make me move to Decatur, Illinois.
Even a co-worker who was stuck in that same traffic mess for an endless period didn’t ever hear what it was about. My internet search came up with nothing. But finally I found a Twitter feed for #Atl Traffic or something like that, saying that it was a gas main leak. The school shooting pretty much made all other news a moot point.
I have been thinking about about the incident and how the bookkeeper was able to talk to the apparently troubled young man and he eventually turned himself in. It seems she was able to do so by trying to establish a rapport, a common bond of humanity. So many of the shooters who go into schools or public places seem to have felt marginalized and estranged and disassociated from other people. How can we help the marginalized feel less so? NPR reported recently about a study that suggests that the negative effects of childhood bullying last into adulthood. I don’t know the answers. You’re right there are lessons to be learned, but are we (as a society) learning those lessons and doing anything about them?
Just so, Lark. These are the issues that we should be discussing, rather than the “City Of/Postal Decatur” folderol.
Given the tone of the some of the defenders of “Postal Decatur isn’t Decatur!” position, it probably fits perfectly well into a discussion of bullying.
+1, for sure
The Decatur/not-Decatur debate is just stupid.
I have heard to the school referred to an “Atlanta school” and I don’t hear people in the City of Atlanta protesting that it’s not in the City of Atlanta but unincorporated Dekalb County.
Come on …. get over yourselves. This guy could have just as easily targeted a school within the Decatur City Limits. Insane people bent on killing people do not know or respect municipal lines.
It is not a debate – it is about the reporting and parents and families getting upset because of sloppy reporting. When Obama came to College Heights, I didn’t give a fig that state, some local and most national news called it an “Atlanta-area school”. I am mostly annoyed that certain people who choose to live outside our community think that hanging out and spending some money in Decatur gives them the right to tell me how I should feel.
You really come across as self-righteous. Get over yourself. Your “trauma” from the “bad reporting” will soon pass…until the next time someone ACCURATELY calls a school located in Decatur a “Decatur Elementary School.” Again, you live in the CITY OF Decatur, not Decatur. And, I lived in the City of Decatur my whole life until the taxes got too high and I had to move to make room for people like yourself.
Like me? I moved here when I was 18 and I am 42. Been here most of my life. So how did I affect you?
No, it’s not about telling you how to feel. It’s not about feelings at all.
It’s expressing our opinion a members of the larger community. You seem to think the only folks who have a right to an opinion about Decatur are those in the city limits. But I think almost anyone will tell you the community is far more expansive that that. I don’t eat or play or volunteer based on city limits.
So really? You have the right to tell Decatur citizens how to run the city because you eat here?
My god, just listen to yourself.
Why so bitter? Oh, I see. You are angry because you had to move so you just want to pick on people and yell rather than talk. Fine. GO for it.
I just don’t like your sense of entitlement. Bitter? Not really, but disappointed is definitely how I feel. You are probably in the minority anyway. No one I grew up with ever gave much of a crap about “postal” Decatur vs. City of Decatur.
>So really? You have the right to tell Decatur citizens how to run the city because you eat here?<
That's absurd. No one said that. I never said that. And you know that.
I have a right to speak about my community. My community is larger than city or county lines. Why is that so difficult? And more to the point, why the contempt? This isn't the first time you've gotten your back up at folks who don't live in COD.
This is a bigger issue than the "postal Decatur" debate. It's about how we understand community. And you and I have a very different understanding. Like it or not, I'm going to sit at your lunch counter.
I don’t think it is that different. I am looking at it in context of different spheres and layers and you are looking at it in the context of the wider meaning and larger philosophical context. Just different thoughts for a specific incident at a specif time colliding like burning cow dung.
Decatur: A city of homes, schools, places of worship and well-defined municipal boundaries.
To quote Men On Film: “That’s an around-the-world and BACK snap!”
Decatur, where Mayberry morphs into 90210. Keep it real y’all.
This:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2013/08/21/antoinette_tuff_michael_brandon_hill_atlanta_school_clerk_says_she_talked.html
I don’t give two figs about Decatur/Not-Decatur “issue.” But the reporting in this case was simply imprecise. It’s a fact that McNair has a Decatur mailing address, but there’s no good reason for a reporter to report a shooting at a “Decatur Elementary School” when the name of the school and its address are known. And with those facts a quick Google search away, there is no reason not to be exact. The lazy reporting resulted in too many unaffected parents wigging out.
You can tell that all of the copy editors and experienced reporters took early retirement when it was offered. But that’s more a “Friday Free-for-All” conversation.
IT IS A DECATUR ELEMENTARY SCHOOL!!!!! YOU DON”T OWN THE RIGHTS TO THE NAME DECATUR…YOU LIVE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR WHICH IS NOT DECATUR.
I wasn’t going to reply to anymore of this, but you are wrong. Decatur is a city. It is not CITY OF DECATUR. I DO NOT LIVE IN CITY OF DECATUR. It only exists as a fiction to distinguish a small town from a larger unincorporated area that receives its mail through the local post office sorting facility.
Decatur has been a city since 1822. It was named after naval hero Stephen Decatur. A few decades ago, as the rural areas around DeKalb County grew without establishing independent cities, the US Postal Service needed a way to identify where to take the mail. Parts of unincorporated DeKalb had its mail routed through post offices in Atlanta. The addresses to those homes and businesses became “ATLANTA” (think Emory and parts of Druid Hills and even parts of VA-High). Other parts had its mail routed through Decatur’s post office. Those parts came to be called DECATUR. Neither of those areas have any civic or municipal ties to Decatur or Atlanta other than where the postal service sends mail to the residents. Should the mail suddenly get routed to different central sorting facilities then the addresses would reflect that city’s name. Those are simply the facts. If you feel differently, I am sorry.
Sorry if you don’t like the reality, but it’s still called Decatur. You DO live in the City of Decatur as did I for quite a long time. Do you get freaked out every time a rapper says they are from Decatur when they don’t live in 30030? What if someone commits a crime and they are reported as being from Decatur because they live in 30032? Does that freak you out or “get your back up”? It’s ironic you call it postal Decatur because that is precisely how you are acting…postal.
I said very clearly that this issue is about the need for sensitivity and accurate reporting in the issue of school shooting and several other people agree. I don’t care where you say you are from but there is no point in being jerk-y and telling people they don’t have a right to express that opinion when people are clearly expressing that they think we are bad people for wanting a little accuracy in such a sensitive topic. The rest that was thrown in – and I that I unwisely replied to- wasn’t even the topic at hand. If you want to talk and stop throwing silly barbs, that would be great.
My comment isn’t about “Decatur” as an area or a municipality. It’s about the sorry state of journalism. The story was first reported as a “shooting at a Decatur Elementary School,” which is not incorrect. But why not report it as “a shooting at McNair Learning Academy in Decatur,” which is more accurate? Better yet, identify it as “DeKalb County’s McNair Learning Academy on 2nd Avenue in Decatur”? It’ simply lazy reporting.
And also, your caps lock is stuck.
I never said you didn’t have a right, but I will call out something I think is ridiculous. Agree to disagree. Good day, ma’am.
Cool. I am know I am not expressing myself well and I got too worked up. Olive branch?
All good.
BTW, if anyone cares, the guy had 500 rounds on him. That bookkeeper is a goddess.
Antionette Tuff – the definition of “clutch.” True hero, that one.
Yes, my favorite part was how she complied with the guy’s request to broadcast his “Sorry” on the intercom but added that everyone should still stay in their classrooms. My guess is that she showed just enough of a touch of understanding and compassion toward the guy, while respecting his space and power, that she got through to him. More than most of us could probably pull off.
I know people are going to pile on me for this, but I am just heartbroken as well for this desperate, mentally ill boy who, beset by mental illness, took this desperate measure. His brother is quoted in one story and sounds like an ass with little inclination to understand his brother’s bipolar disorder. If only people in his life were like this woman it might not have happened.
From WXIA:
School employee Tuff said she worked to convince the gunman to put down his weapons and ammunition.
“He told me he was sorry for what he was doing. He was willing to die,” Tuff said in an interview on ABC’s World News with Diane Sawyer.
She said she told him her life story, including about the end of her marriage after 33 years.
“I told him, ‘OK, we all have situations in our lives,'” she said. “It was going to be OK. If I could recover, he could, too.”
Tuff said she asked the suspect to put his weapons and backpack down.
“I told the police he was giving himself up. I just talked him through it,” she said.
This just made me cry. Just now. It is just painful all the way around.
OK, Nellie my dear, you and I just can’t seem to get on the same page this week…
“His brother is quoted in one story and sounds like an ass with little inclination to understand his brother’s bipolar disorder. If only people in his life were like this woman it might not have happened.” — First, there is really no way of knowing, based on what some news outlet quoted, what his brother actually said in context. You know that and I know that.
Second, unless you have an immediate family member with bipolar disorder, you need to stand down. You want to judge somebody? Judge us collectively for not having more rational and compassionate policies and procedures for mental health care. But stay the hell off the backs of the families of people who are sick.
I actually do – my mom’s twin sister’s son- he and I were brought up as siblings. My kids call him uncle and his think I am their aunt. But that is beside the point. I guess the contrast between the brother’s statements and what the bookkeeper said just hit me hard. The apology, what the kids went through, what Antoinette did- the tragedy of the whole thing. I am hormonal and everything is making me cry :). And oh hell yeah, I blame our mental health systems and the segments of society that shun mental illness as something to be shamed and not cared for… Yeah, probably shouldn’t have called him an ass, but the hard contrast between his statements and Antoinette’s amazing grace just punched me in the gut. Where did she find that?
I was likewise moved by her fortitude, presence of mind, and overwhelming kindness. I am thankful for her sake and everybody else’s that she came up with it. I also feel compassion for the young man. But again…what I said before…we can’t know what the brother actually said or the precise context of the conversation. AND family members are often the last people from whom the ill person will accept kindness, support or grace of any kind.
Part 1 of the interview with Michael Hill’s brother Timothy on WSB-TV:
http://www.wsbtv.com/videos/news/brother-of-mcnair-shooting-suspect-speaks-pt-1/v9bQc/
I am agreeing with you about the context- I had an emotional reaction to the way the statement read on the page. Sorry I was not clear.
Watch both parts of the interview with the gunman’s brother. Sounds like their mother and the whole family was trying to get him help, reaching out to the mental health treatment community and the juvenile justice system, to no avail. The brother describes the system failing him, offering no real consequences or viable treatment for what sounds like a long history of fairly serious acts – shoplifting, breaking into schools and churches, violence, and setting his family’s house on fire while they were all inside. The brother describes reaching out to him until he could no longer, when he threatened to kill him.
Thanks for posting that. It makes me feel better for the guy. I was reading articles since I don’t watch a lot of news – and long ago and far away that was the better resource than TV journalism. None of the articles I read gave this much detail.
So, what are we as a COMMUNITY OF PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN DEKALB COUNTY IN THE STATE OF GEORGIA going to do for this woman? This not a medal from Nathan Deal kind of situation. She needs to have the President personally thank her for being kick ass along with a parade and some ice cream.
Sounds like the system failed us, not him, by not keeping him in jail. Arson is a pretty serious crime.
It failed us, him (it’s not fun being that disturbed; when their illness is under control, most mentally ill folks want to be healthy, good people), the family who tried to do the right thing, the children, teachers, and staff who had to experience a fear no one should have to experience.
that’s Antoinette, in the spirit of accurate reporting
This has been…illuminating.
Yes, in a dark sort of way.
I’m thinking of those poor kids, who are my neighbors. I don’t live in their zip code anymore, but I’m sure my kids have played with of them at the YMCA play place, danced alongside some of them in dance class, waved shyly at them from across the aisle at East Lake Publix (because my kids always wave at other kids who are the same age, thinking they may make a friend). I’m thinking of how terrified my kindergartener would be on the second week of school, or any week of school, to hear about a scary man with a gun who wanted to hurt children and to be herded to an unfamiliar place, not sure when she could be comforted by her mommy. Tears for those children, are my neighbors even though I live 5 miles away, and who are surely traumatized.
And the parents. Images from Sandy Hook keep entering my mind. This was one woman away from being Sandy Hook a troubled boy with a gun and poorly treated mental illness.
I hope against hope the kids just think it was a drill. East Cobb schools were doing intruder drills last week and had a run through with parents Tuesday night. Oakhurst kids did intruder drills yesterday. We had inclement weather drills when I was a kid.
We had air raid drills when I was a kid. Those were pretty scary.
Duck and cover! Everybody squat down under your desks with your heads tucked into your chests and your arms wrapped around your legs! Because when they drop the big one that will surely protect you. Yeah, those were simpler times.
Decatur, GA mentioned in Wonkette. Never thought I’d see that.
http://wonkette.com/526331/nice-time-good-guy-with-a-calm-voice-stops-a-bad-guy-with-a-gun
The Ed Show radio show just played the conversation between Antoinette and the police as she made them promise not to shoot the boy if she walked out with him.
Read the following about her on Slate.
“In what may be the most incredible moment in a tape full of them—one that comes after Tuff has convinced Hill to surrender and shortly before the police come in—the school clerk tells Hill that she loves him. “It’s gonna be all right, sweetie,” she says. “I just want you to know that I love you, though, OK? And I’m proud of you. That’s a good thing. You’ve just given up. Don’t worry about it.” It’s only later, after police have Hill in custody, that we hear Tuff’s voice waver. “Let me tell you something, baby,” she tells the dispatcher. “I’ve never been so scared in all the days of my life.”
Yes, the bookkeeper is definitely a hero. I was also stuck by how much her faith in God came into play during the ordeal. She talked very openly about praying for the gunman and recalling a recent sermon by her pastor as giving her strength and focus. Amen to that!