UPDATE II: Here’s the official Decatur PD summary of the incident…
On Wednesday, July 3, 2013 at approximately 8:57am, the Decatur Police Department was notified of a carjacking in the 200 block of Swanton Way. The suspect approached a female, showed a firearm, stole the victim’s vehicle, and fled the location in the stolen vehicle. Responding officers observed the vehicle on East Trinity Place, at which time they attempted to stop the vehicle. The suspect fled in the vehicle at a high rate of speed onto South Candler Street. The suspect lost control of the vehicle causing it to overturn at the intersection of South Candler Street at Kirk Road. A 15 year old male has been apprehended and is in custody for the charges of armed robbery, hijacking a motor vehicle, possession of a firearm during the commission of a crime and numerous traffic offenses.
The suspect sustained a minor laceration to his left hand as a result of the accident. The victim of the carjacking was not injured.
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UPDATE: More couple more pics of the crash after the jump.
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According to eyewitness reports on Facebook and a new report on Patch, a carjacking in downtown Decatur this morning resulted in the crash of a stolen red SUV on South Candler Street around 9am this morning. Decatur Police said they would have an announcement out soon.
Eyewitnesses stated that the driver of the SUV crawled out of it after it flipped over along the street. A white pickup truck was also involved at the crash site. Patch says that neighbors saw police remove a gun from the rear of the flipped vehicle.
Working on adding a photo, if I can get the site to cooperate. Apologies for all the issues. Site’s getting hit really hard this morning and apparently it can’t handle it.
More as we have it.
Photo courtesy of a concerned citizen
OK, site situation is improving. A couple more pics after the jump.
from the Oakhurst Yahoo group:
“I’m posting this to make sure everyone in the Kirkwood/East Atlanta/East Lake/Decatur area is being very careful while out and about. I was robbed at gunpoint at around 5:25pm at the playground at Oakhurst Park. There were 3 young black males around 15-17 years old or so that were sitting around oddly near the playground. My gut feeling was to leave and when I finally began to, they noticed and one grabbed another woman’s phone and keys off a blanket while another shot their pistol in the air and then ran over to me and ****in the stroller. They didn’t get mine but they got off with the other and took off in her car. There were several parents, children and babies there.
Keep your eyes open for strange behavior. Trust your instincts. Leave immediately and call the police. Put the non-emergency number in your phone. If you’re in City of Decatur, it’s 404-373-6551. I lived in City of Atlanta too and still have that one: 404-658-6666.
An officer just left my house and told me the kids are from Kirkwood and they are hitting up the area quite a bit lately, applepicking smart phones and breaking into cars. They mugged another female just this morning and fired a shot in the air as well during that incident. They are armed and dangerous.
I felt something was odd about them. I know kids hanging out, bored, trying to pass the time and I know kids that are plotting. I wish I had left 5 minutes before that. I know I overheard “get that iPhone.” Ugh. Also don’t be brave. I told the kid “no” and then he put the gun to my shoulder and asked me if I wanted to die. I shrugged and said “you’re not taking my phone” and pulled my phone away from him. Thank goodness he saw the anger in my eyes and as I saw the fear in his and he ran off. I’m a very sweet gentle person but on rare defensive occasions, something else can come out. Don’t do it though. The officer that came to interview me said they are getting braver each time they act out. I was lucky. The next time, they may kill. Be careful, neighbors. I’m going to have another drink and go to bed. — feeling exhausted.”
In other news, City of Decatur has postponed July 4 celebration until September 28. Not a good week so far in Decatur. But intense rain may deter some crimes. Common wisdom is that car thefts increase in the rain because thieves don’t like walking or biking around wet. But the current crop of thugs seem to have vehicles already…….
Maybe we should skip the firecrackers and home fireworks, illegal and legal? So we don’t mistake real shots for celebratory noise?
Original post has been updated with DPD’s release regarding the incident.
OMG, a 15 year old. Many fifteen year old boys are still working on remembering to tie their shoes. The frontal lobe of a boy this age is nowhere near ready for dealing with criminal pressures, handling firearms, and/or driving at high speed. Not a good world we live in when 15 year old boys are committing crimes like this.
I blame it on income inequality.
Dismiss that as a factor all you won’t… but watch as it rises and crime rates begin to rise again too.
How does one make income equal? “Income inequality” is just a silly made up thing. I’m sure these guys are well educated scholars that have a four year degrees and are just upset that they don’t get paid as much as the next guy. Riiiiiiight.
How is income inequality a made up thing? And who said anything about making incomes equal? You are considering the issue in a very simplistic, talk radio sort of way.
I think you are the one looking at this simplistically. There are FAR greater forces at work here than “income inequality.” Of course your premises relies on the theory that we have a finite income “pie” and it needs to be distributed equally, instead of one in which we just increase the size of the pie. But i digress….
In my opinion, one of the biggest factors contributing to this behavior is the entitlement culture we have created in this country. Along with our continued “war on drugs” and our stagnant economy….
No, my theory is based on the fact that there is a widening gap between the bottom income levels and the upper levels and this is borne out by statistics. Even on the micro level, Decatur, it’s easy to see that kids in poor neighborhoods nearby can look and see greater wealth here and target the area, both out of resentment exacerbated by race and, in the words of the famous bank robber, becaus. tthat’s where the money is. Not saying that’s the only factor, and I agree with the issues you mentioned too. And though taboo for liberals to mention, single parent households, especially poor ones, have to be considered a factor as well.
Income inequality is a real statistical measurement used by economists, and it’s actually a really important one. The Gini coefficient is one way of measuring this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient), but there are others. Income inequality correlates with all sorts of social problems. We ignore it at our own peril.
Maybe if you reframed it as “haves and have nots.” I’m pretty sure you’d find some examples throughout history of things getting messy as the result of wealth and resource disparity.
You can make light of their situation all you want. And sit on your high horse and feel smug about how you are motivated and have “made it” and these scumbags are lazy parasites. That’s fine. But in the meantime, that great sucking sound you hear is all the wealth moving to the fat bank accounts of the richest of the rich. And the programs that would help provide a hand up to the underclass go unfunded and dry up. You can dismiss this idea all you want. That’s fine. But there are plenty of examples around the world where the wealth of a nation is used for the good of everyone, no matter their situation. And guess what, those countries don’t have a prison-industrial complex like our nation. They don’t have murder rates, crime rates, poor school testing rates, on and on. Maybe the rich deserve it. That’s fine. But until we, as a society, provide a future and hope for these thugs they will remain thugs and continue to steal our flatscreens. Signed a card carrying pinko from the People’s Republic of Decatur.
I’m far from making light of the situation, my friend. I truly believe that policies YOU subscribe to are what contributes to keeping people down. We have been doing it your way for way too long. How has that worked out? We want the same things, you and I. Just different ways to get them accomplished.
Some would argue we’ve been doing it your way for too long : thirty years of tax cuts, deregulation, social program cuts, underinvestment in almost every part of American infrastructure.
Are you suggesting that we have reduced the amount of money spent on social programs over the last 30 years? Not even close. Increased dramatically. Are you suggesting that we have decreased regulations over the past 30 years? You must be joking. Hell, they increased almost 8% in Obama’s first three years! No, my friend, we have not been doing it my way the last 30 years.
Walrus, your initial comment — I blame it on income inequality — was making light of the situation. And your comment suggests that you think the widening gap between the very wealthy and the rest of U.S. society is not a problem. I think it is. So I seriously doubt that we want the same things. As far as regulation is concerned, it might be a problem. But the sky didn’t fall when the Clear Air Act and Clean Water Act were passed and I’m sure business complained about those as well. But those laws had benefits that were greater than the costs borne by business. I believe moderation and common sense are the key to these questions but those ideas are lost in our current political environment and on those House Republicans who believe in “my way or nothing at all.”
In relative terms and in aggregate, social programs for the poor have been cut over the last thirty years. Little has been done in the last three years to change that.
Walrus: You apparently have a penchant for bringing out the old clichés from your friendly neighbors! Agreed, there are clearly numerous cultural issues involved here. There are more safety nets in place then ever before, and the perps aren’t lacking for basics. BTW, how high up is that horse anyway?? Just curious,
Just where do you get that there are more “safety nets” in place than ever before? Tried to qualify for welfare lately? Subsidized housing? Not saying perps commit crimes because they can’t get welfare; that’s a simplistic, one-to-one equation. But these things filter down and have indirect ramifications.
Frankly, Walrus, I’ll bet you haven’t a clue about the extent of income inequality in our country, or more fairly, let me say, until ***I**** watched this video, I had no clue, and neither do most other Americans. This is unhealthy; there is a direct correlation between income inequality and many of the problems we’re witnessing, and I’d challenge you to find a sane economist who:
a) believes it is a healthy distribution
or
b) believes the way to solve it is by “increasing the size of the pie”
The freaking size of the pie isn’t the problem–the fact that we enable the unfettered accumulation of so much wealth by such a minuscule portion of our population to the detriment of the health of our economy is the problem. How anyone could truly enjoy that much wealth within their castled walls while the countryside crumbles is beyond me, but apparently it’s not only possible, it’s applauded by those pipedreaming of entering the castle’s gates.
Me? I’m quite happy with my little bungalow in Oakhurst–happiness, meaning, and life satisfaction doesn’t scale with money for me, but all of those things are diminished when my community is threatened by the swelling discontent of the have nots.
this video’s graphics are being chopped by the indent in this thread. recommend you click the title at the upper left corner of the video and watch it on YouTube. it’s staggering.
But you know it’s just a silly, made-up thing, right? It seems most everything that those on the right don’t want to hear about (climate change, income inequality, corporate hegemony) are just inventions.
For the millionth time, I’m not on “the right”. I am a libertarian. Though I am “right.” 😉
what’s your Libertarian take on the video? c’est la vie?
I will let you know when I can get some volume…
“An imbalance between rich and poor is the oldest and most fatal ailment of all republics.”
– Plutarch
Agreed. Because of this:
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years.”
-Alexander Fraser Tytler
Look people, there is obviously a wealth gap. We just have very different views on why that is and what can be done to close it. The liberal/democrat party (and to a just barely lessor extent the republican party) plan in my mind will do nothing but either make the gap wider or make ALL of us poorer. I want EVERYONE to prosper as much as possible. Knocking that “haves” down is not required.
Walrus, good luck and godspeed in your argument with the DM echo-chamber.
“The time has come, the Walrus said, to talk of many things: of shoes and ships and sealing wax, of cabbages and kings, and why the sea is boiling hot, and whether pigs have wings.”
Lewis Carroll
If in your mind “knocking the haves down” means making them pay more taxes, it may well be required. Cutting them sure hasn’t worked.
I vaguely remember studying in college that class/income/social inequalities combined with rising expectations caused much of the unrest of the 20th Century, including the overthrow of colonial powers and the Civil Rights Movement. I’m wondering about whether inequalities and DECLINING expectations are now in play, resulting in negative vs. positive trends. I certainly have declining expectations for my retirement and old age given the status of our economy and financial and social safety nets. I can imagine that folks with much fewer resources would feel negative, maybe hopeless, maybe cynical, maybe angry. Combine that with a 15 year old’s frontal lobe, drugs, inadequate education provided by DCSS/ACS and who knows what other stressors………..not good chemistry.
I blame the criminals.
One of the reasons that Conservatives/Republicans/the Right have so little credibility at this time is because they use occasions like this to start pillowfights with silly liberals rather than rise above. Rush Limbaugh would be proud of The Walrus’ emotional reaction. I just have to shake my head at the continuing trashing of the conservative brand.
One – I’m not a conservative. Two – I blame the criminals as well. How did I have an emotional response?
Maybe it’s just me, but partisan sniping on the internets is more toward emotional than rational.
But carry on. It’s not like Libertarians should be taken seriously or anything.
Ah, so the sniping was just one way. Got it.
You are a real class act. Certainly open minded….
You and I probably agree on 95% of our political views. I’d just prefer us good guys acted like it in public. Let the looney liberals make fools of themselves, we don’t need to get involved. Peace.
get a room!
My bad that i didn’t get your sarcasm. 🙁
Older gang members often succeed in getting underage recruits to do their criminal activity for them because 1) younger teens are more easily persuaded to do something stupid; 2) they are reassured that, as juveniles, they’ll get off easier.
This crime situation is becoming terrorism…they are being reckless because they know it’s causing fear. Do we need to FBI/National Guard or something to come in??
Seriously?
Come on, hyperbole much?
I’m really hoping that Decatur PD can get this kid to give up the names of the other guys doing this sort of thing.
Indeed. The armed robberies on the 1st and 2nd were committed by young boys this age and this area’s violent crime is not usually this bad. Let’s hope he was one of the ones involved in the armed robberies or knows who they are.
I can’t imagine a 15-yr-old would be that familiar with fencing a stolen vehicle for money, so I doubt money is the factor. He was likely prompted/encouraged by someone older and more experienced to do this.
I wonder if this is gang related. Seems like a kid that age must have an additional motivation beyond money to try something like this.
Money is not necessarily the motivation – acceptance into the gang is. It’s just members paying their dues.
Well, that may be, but then what do you think their activity once in the gang is going to be? I’d think if it’s initiation it’s also rehearsal.
I’m really hoping that our silent City leadership will actually step up and address this situation. Now that there’s not a 4th of July festival to hide behind, seems the wise thing to do…
Where is out mayor? Missing Bill Floyd at times like these. Can’t he just pretend to be the mayor for awhile while this crisis gets sorted out?
If you want your voice to be heard, or if you want to pass along helpful information, I suggest sending the mayor a note at [email protected].
Note: I suggest sending helpful, logical and well-considered insights. I do NOT suggest sending the mayor flippant comments as to the ‘why aren’t you doing anything?!?!’ variety.
Let’s help our elected leaders understand our concerns, our requests for leadership and guidance, and lend some insight into how we’re being affected by a very real feeling of fear for our community.
Agreed. But keep in mind that the Mayor, while able to set the agenda of commission meetings, does not have any greater authority than the other commissioners. Which is all to say that, in addition to reaching out to the Mayor, make sure to do the same with your other representatives — presumably Patti and Kecia.
The Mayor may not have any greater authority than the other commissioners, Scott, but he is “the Mayor.” Bill Floyd took on that role of being the leader of the entire city – even through he only represented District 1. I think many people are looking for a little leadership right now and would like to hear the Mayor or the other Commissioners make some sort of statement.
Maybe our police department could offer classes or certification in firearm usage and safety. I believe there is evidence that a highly armed citizenry is the best defense against criminals.
No scientific evidence for that.
If anything it would be the opposite if considered globally. Developed countries that have little or no firearm ownership have far lower crime rates than the U.S. Not that it’s the only factor, of course.
I’m assuming that Mr. B will not be providing any evidence. This seems to be the norm on here. Mr. B says something, someone asks for proof of the assertion. No proof ever appears.
Not that you will give it any credit, but here you go. In the paper, it is stated that 18 studies that found concealed carry laws reduced violent crime, ten that said it has no discernable effect and one that found it increased violent crime.
http://digitalcommons.law.umaryland.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=3522&context=mlr
You’re welcome.
As my favorite professor once said, pay attention to who is paying for “research.” I haven’t confirmed it, but my guess is that this guy is funded by the gun lobby.
“Gun researcher John Lott … uses his media platform to push a multitude of statistics — often from his own research — he has been thoroughly discredited as a serious academic researcher”.
http://mediamatters.org/research/2012/12/17/who-is-gun-advocate-john-lott/191885
Washington Post factchecker looked into this, and on balance the evidence does seem to support the idea that concealed carry laws lead to lower crime rates, although it is not definitive.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/do-concealed-weapon-laws-result-in-less-crime/2012/12/16/e80a5d7e-47c9-11e2-ad54-580638ede391_blog.html
After reading that article, I came away with the impression that it’s unclear whether there’s a relationship. I’ve seen more scholarly reviews of the issue but not sure I’m motivated enough to go find one. We’ll have to handle our immediate crime spree in Decatur long before the issue is resolved in science and politics. Can’t say that Mr. B’s “armed citizenry” is what I want here in Mayberry/Berkeley/Decatur, whether or not it prevents crime. I’d probably pick a different community if most Decatur homes had guns.
oh, i don’t know, “The Decatur 9mm Festival” has a certain ring to it.
What makes you think most Decatur homes don’t already have guns?
Because, when my children were younger, I always asked before any playdate or sleepover, as recommended by our pediatrician. If the family had guns, I asked about how they were stored and locked. Very few had guns. Actually, I’m not sure anyone did but I may be misremembering.
Did you ask if they had a swimming pool? Stairs? Big chefs knives? Sharp cornered countertops? You know, things that are FAR more likely to harm your child than a gun. My doctor once asked asked me if I had a gun in the home during a physical. He is now my former doctor….
Swimming pool is also a good cautionary question. But Walrus, I’m hoping this attitude you have towards folks asking about catastrophically lethal weapons means that you have never experienced or been related to gun violence in the home. Someone I new growing up accidentally killed his brother when he was five. Buns had been removed from the house of a deeply depressed relative, but they went to a neighbor’s house where they knew a shotgun was loosely stored, and used it to end their life- along with another felative’s. so the first time I was asked by a parent @ guns in our home, it took me by surprise, but I wasn’t offended b/c I thought it was a smart question.
And yes, good knives do kill, but not well or easily enough for gun enthusiasts to give up their right to bear arms- and are something almost universally taught to children as a cautionary item. Not so with guns.
Also, I do support your right to own guns- though I think as a society we do not manage that right very well at all.
Tablet = typos, and inability to use the edit function- I hope you can decipher the above.
I don’t have to ask about swimming pools! The number of swimming pools in the back of Decatur yards is very small and those pools are obvious, Mostly condos/townhomes. But I would not let my kids visit if the pool were not properly gated/locked and supervised. Guns are not so obvious–a good thing if that means they are locked up safely from children. We trust our pediatrician(s) (they have a tendency to die or move on us) because of the wise counsel and treatment they have given us over time
Also the risk of swimming pools vs. guns depends on the age of the child, the prevalence of guns or swimming pools n the community, and the prevalence of safety measures.
From my equally scientific surveys I would say you’re wrong and that there are many more firearms in homes (and on belts, and in pockets) than you believe. In fact, I bet this week the numbers have grown even larger. Even so, please reconsider moving.
Too bad the story didn’t end, “I pulled my firearm from its concealed location on my person and shot the perpetrator until he stopped becoming a threat.”
The ONLY thing tht will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.
The “only” thing?? That’s a good one, very funny take on things.
We used to have a small police station in the downtown district of Oakhurst. Maybe we need to bring it back. I have lived here for 14 yrs. and have never seen this much crime. We need to catch these people. It’s ridiculous!
+1 – Yes it might be time to open that back up.
There is a vacant spot at the end of the Family Dollar building
Top story on AJC.com, not surprisingly…
http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/carjacking-latest-in-a-series-of-crimes-to-hit-dec/nYctN/
I grew up poor as hell! I have never stolen cars, or robbed people! We live in a world where we have glorified having things and we treat poor people badly, and we make fun of them. These kids have been taught that it is ok to be violent and nasty. Too many of our well to do kids are being taught they are “owed” something as well. Many of them are on drugs, hanging out on the square smoking pot. Some of the poor kids are busting their butts and moving forward. Some of the kids who have a lot are volunteering and sharing their good fortune. No matter how much cash you have you can be taught to respect or taught to be nasty!
It’s always so great to see you all turn on each other during these times. :-/
yep, just what the criminals (or terrorists, depending on how you label them) want us to do. also nice to see we’re finally settling this nagging right wing/left wing problem once and for all. this is a perfect forum to do so.
sadly, DM, positive change rarely occurs in the best of times–humans require crisis to awaken them from their sleepwalking ways and come to terms with problems. it’s unfortunate but necessary that we wrestle–hugs will only get us so far.
that said, i remain impressed by the level of civility this site maintains even when people get testy with one another.
Agreed. I have stopped reading comments almost everywhere else (I slipped up today — did anyone else catch the inane comments on the AJC article before they were pulled?), but here I actually can learn from the various opposing viewpoints.
the ajc.com comment section is a cesspool of racism and bigotry.
An insult to cesspools everywhere.
Indeed. I hardly ever look at ajc.com but sometimes can’t stop myself from glancing at the comments–it’s like looking at a gory car wreck. Then I have the urge to take a shower and disinfect my laptop.
And that’s just on the Food and Dining blog…
Of course we don’t see what DM sees, i.e. what gets moderated and deleted, but the disagreements here are, in my view, mostly civil and non ad hominem. None of the racist nonsense and other garbage like on AJC and even some of the Patch sites.
Dang, I wasn’t advocating hugs. That’s about the ugliest thing anyone has said to me in a long while! I have long held the view that we need to have difficult conversations and face each other’s differing opinions. That’s half of why this pain-in-the-ass site still exists. Still, my spidey-sense was telling me that I needed to make a :-/ face, especially for all the new commenters who have chimed in.
I’m curious, DM: Do crime stories bring more traffic to the site, or just more comments?
There were around 125 people on the site at any given time all day today.
Compared to?
No no no. No one is “turning on each other.” Just some good debatin’. Any of these cats can come over and have a drink with me anytime. Of course, I will not allow them to confiscate my quality beer and distribute them to crap beer owners…. 😉
As a St. Bernardus drinking Marie Antoinette never said:
“Then let them drink Coors Light.”
Good God Man!! Have you lost your Mind… What a waste of good beer!!
I think brianc raised an interesting point. I also think brianc should have given Walrus a -1 instead of taking the bait.
dm 2013/07/03/decatur-police-alert-armed-robbery-of-three-women-in-oakhurst-park-yesterday-afternoon/#comment-406119
dm 2013/07/03/carjacking-in-downtown-decatur-ends-in-crash-and-suspect-apprehension-on-south-candler/#comment-406157
DM, I thought that was a pea green, but I think now it’s peo — I mean soylent green
At some point, the criminals always do something stupid and get caught, hurt, dead, or in jail. Today’s car jacking – case in point. While this kid is a juvy, his punishment will not be fun and it is unlikely he can afford a lawyer good enough to get him off as is the case in many higher crimes. It’s hard for a cop to be in right place at the right time even with one every square mile. Statistics are not on the side of repeat criminals however. Note that they were on him before he was out of the city limits. If you feel threatened in anyway, call the cops! 911 is easy.
Parents, do you know where your 15 year old is? Do you have any idea how he’s spending his days while you’re at work and he’s home from school? No? YOU”RE the problem.
Period.
Doc, I’m guessing these kids don’t have much parental input in their lives, otherwise they wouldn’t be influenced by gang bros who want to take them under their wings, or even pay attention to them.
I volunteered for a Head Start program in college, and the boys in there were starved for male attention. I hope I was a positive influence, but knew as soon as I left for the summer, the influence they received would be non-existent or detrimental.
Blaming this on income inequality assumes poor people don’t know right from wrong, and can’t decide whether it’s ok or not to put a gun to someone’s head, or steal a car which is total BS. I have known many poor people throughout my life, who worked horrible crappy jobs, for minimum wage or only slightly more, and managed to make it through their lives without armed robbery, murdering anyone or stealing anything. We need to make sure kids get a fair chance and that starts with schools, but immigrants come here with nothing, work menial jobs saving to start a business, and then do it. Maybe certain cultures, (yes being PC), need to address their glorification of violence, pillaging, gang life, and the attitude that only ‘suckas” go to work at low-paying jobs.
“Maybe certain cultures, (yes being PC), need to address their glorification of violence, pillaging, gang life, and the attitude that only ‘suckas” go to work at low-paying jobs.”
I agree completely. Andrew Jackson killed thousands of people and yet white culture worships him by putting him on a $20 bill. They love TV shows which try to portray murderers and gang members as “complex” or “misunderstood” like Dexter or The Sopranos. It’s no wonder so many white people end up that way when you look at how their culture glorifies criminals.
[grabs his popcorn]
yes, continuuuuuue
You’ll need a big bowl since lately everything seems to be going to moderation. Including my response to John.
I’ve rectified the issue that was sending so much to moderation.
I actually happen to agree. It must be roving bands of Dexter wannabees terrorizing East Atlanta, Grant Park and Atlanta. When they apprehend the man killed Patrick Cotrona he’ll probably say something like, “all I ever wanted was to be like Dexter.”
If we were in NJ, you may have a point about the Sopranos wannabes, but the police have given no indication it’s the Italian mafia based here, so I’ll trust them on that one. I don’t personally know anyone who “worships” Jackson, that may not be as common as you seem to believe.
In your eagerness to turn my comment into something it wasn’t , you conveniently ignored, “Of course all cultures/races have crime,” what a total shock.
And btw, this isn’t strictly black on white issue if that makes you feel any better about wanting to talk about the recent wave of crimes and culprits rationally. I personally know 2 people who have both been violently robbed in the past year, one I worked with who was beaten in broad daylight downtown and had his ipad stolen, the other had a gun put to his head just last week and had his phone and wallet stolen, both victims were black men. They both described their attackers as resembling… Michael C. Hall, or not.
If we were in the sticksville rural America we’d be having this conversation about rednecks and methfaces as the culprits, but we are in Atlanta, and if you haven’t noticed, on the news everyday police are suggesting this is a gang problem, not a white serial killer problem. Feel free to continue making ridiculous suggestions and dancing around the real problems we face if it makes you feel better about yourself. It will do nothing to help catch these guys.
Those immigrant groups you speak of also had and continue to have gang and criminal cultures. Just not as visible in this part of town (or the country).
While the police have given us only a vague description of the perpetrators, all your posts seem to go after anyone who acknowledges that a.) we report suspicious activity by black males as the police have suggested, or b.) really anyone who disagrees with you about some of the root causes of this. I don’t want to degrade this discussion, but the police have told us what the suspects look like, and you can’t seem to accept that for some reason. Of course all cultures/races have crime, but if you haven’t noticed lately, the whole city seems to be under this wave of crime. From a dude getting shot in the face walking home from a Braves game to another guy murdered in East Atlanta this month. Being PC at this point when we know who the suspects are is just totally naive. If we are going to catch these guys we need to be on the lookout, and I’m sorry if it offends you, but yes, be on the lookout for suspicious young black males. Do you want to stay PC , or do you want to help catch these guys before they kill again? It’s only a matter of time.
Some of the posts, the ones I would have went after, advocated reporting young black males for being present in parks, sitting on a wall, and other “suspicious” activity. Sorry if you don’t like being called out on your calls for racial profiling. Dismissing my reaction as “being PC” is a slippery but transparent bit of rhetoric. Why not mock me for being “sensitive” too?
The people sitting on the wall robbed the women at gunpoint. They looked out of place for whatever reason, no one acted, and these women became crime victims. Did you even read the story? People need to use some very simple common sense. The police have issued multiple statements about who are committing the crimes, I’m sure you’ve seen them and I don’t really understand your reluctance to acknowledge that.
Alerting the police to any activity isn’t going to get someone stopped and frisked here. But chances are if the police start cruising down a street, or patrolling a park where they have been called about suspicious activity, if the people are up to no good, they will get out of there quickly. And that’s the goal.
I’m not refusing to acknowledge anything. But I can tell you I am refusing to call the police just because I see young black males in parks or walking down streets, which has NOT been recommended in any official police statements.
“all your posts seem to go after anyone who acknowledges that a.) we report suspicious activity by black males as the police have suggested,”
So I guess that means only suspicious activity by black males should be reported? I’m pretty sure the police suggested reporting “suspicious activity”, period, but maybe you interpreted it otherwise.
One factor that has not been brought up is the education or lack of education of students in our country. Many studies have shown that a large percentage of criminals have some type of learning disability, many of which are not diagnosed. Students slip through the cracks everyday and despite federal law (FAPE) that says all students are entitled to a “Free and Appropriate Education,” schools do not provide the appropriate education for students with learning disabilities. They need research-based methods that have scientifically proven results. Studies using MRI’s have shown the success of these methods. Students don’t need standardized tests that don’t truly reflect what they can do or arbitrary numbers that determine they are not “learning-disabled enough” to be able to receive help in public school. The way students like this are allowed to slip through the cracks because of money, political motives, and creative wording describing them as “fragile readers” or “almost on grade level” is shameful. After years of a student hearing they aren’t good enough, lazy, dumb, faking, etc., their self-esteem has plummeted. Combine this with unhealthy home environments, as well as some of the other struggles mentioned above and many of these kids turn to crime.
Agree. Many learning disabled kids, from mild to severe, are not getting what they need for instruction. To properly address that topic would be a threadjack. It doesn’t help that state funding declines work against them. Schools of education, school administrators, and curriculae that haven’t kept up to date with the neuroscience of learning don’t help.
What causes 15 year olds to try robbing people with a gun is going to be multifactorial. It’s not just being poor. Or having a single parent. Or being learning disabled. Or a lack of teen jobs and recreation. Or the presence of gangs in the neighborhood. Or cruddy local schools that cheat to make AYP. Or a lack of religious or ethical instruction. Or being part of a discriminated group. We all know folks with one or more of those characteristics who have succeeded and are model citizens. It’s when the combination of those factors becomes a toxic soup for developing minds that there’s a problem. The exact interaction of individual biology and toxic factors that causes a kid to go wrong isn’t known. If we knew, a lot of good people would be trying harder to prevent it.
+1000
Thanks PJ. Yours is an interesting comment that I believe many in Decatur will agree with. My opinion is that any discussion of a 15 year old’s possible disability, education, emotional stage, income level, number of parents, friendship group, brain development, or any other excuse means absolutely nothing when he or she puts a gun to the head of an innocent victim, steals their property, and endangers the lives of other law-abiding citizens while attempting to escape down a residential street. I find it hard to believe that so many posters seem to have so much sympathy for the criminal rather than the victim.
I came up with two different endings to this post. Take your pick.
1. On a lighter note, I wish everyone a Happy Independence Day/Fourth of July. As I recall, our ancestors fought a revolution against a king who allowed (among other things) “…the merciless Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions…” to terrorize law-abiding citizens. We should not let that happen again. God Bless America!
2. On a lighter note, I wish everyone a Happy Independence Day/Fourth of July. As I recall, our ancestors faced much greater challenges but survived and even prospered, in part because they believed in “… a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.” We should work together to resolve our current problems. God Bless America!
Inman Park does it. Is it time for Oakhurst (or other areas) to have private security? Maybe one guy in a car patrolling?
I’m not sure who pays in IPV – businesses, residents, HOA? But whoever does feels like enhanced security is worth paying for aside from property taxes for APD. That’s a larger area, but just asking the question.
I’ll still hug anyone who completely dimisses this option.
This kind of crime isn’t anything new–just new to us in Decatur. I’m guessing that word has gotten out that Decatur is a wealthy middle-class area that hasn’t been tapped and therefore might be an easier target?
As far as cell hone theft goes, I blame that on those cash-for-cell phone Eco ATMs like the one in Greenbriar Mall are to blame. I contend that those should be relocated to police stations….
I agree, not new to Atl, it just has been highlighted here by the recent cluster of events and a vocal population that has centralized vehicles to converse about the issue (DM, patch, neighborhood Facebook pages and list serves.). I will never get over my shock at someone being shot INSIDE of Rosa Mexicana @ 7 years ago and it not even making the front section of the AJC, let alone the front page. Interesting that the current Decatur issues have made the front page instead. I would suggest the AJC coverage is just b/c they’ve figured out people are talking @ it here, not because the crime is that different than other areas of the city.
Though the “phone ATMs” might play a small role, they don’t pay enough and have enough obstacles for criminals to be unappealing. Keep in mind that an Iphone without a contract subsidy is a 500+ dollar item. There is a ready market of people without the credit to qualify for a subsidized smartphone. It’s easier and more lucrative for criminals to sell to this market than to a legitimate recycling company.
“This kind of crime isn’t anything new–just new to us in Decatur. I’m guessing that word has gotten out that Decatur is a wealthy middle-class area that hasn’t been tapped and therefore might be an easier target?” — I think that has a lot to do with it. When I moved to Oakhurst 14 yrs ago there were a few crack dealers here and there, and 2nd/Hosea was no picnic, but we didn’t have this. We had our share of shady neighborhood characters but I never felt particularly threatened beyond routine precautions. (lock the car with no valuables visible, lock up bike & tool shed, outside lights at night, stay alert when walking about after dark, etc.)
amen.
back in the day, we had lots of “flavorful” neighbors, but they were our neighbors and we spoke when we saw them on the sidewalk. i still laugh at some of the stories from back then. the only thing i had stolen in the 90s was a small azalea plant, a concrete Buddha, and a leaf blower, and re: the blower, when i confronted the guy i’d been told stole it he said, “bbbbbuttttt, Rick, you had two blowers, and i took the smallest one!”
these kids are from Kirkwood–they don’t know us, have no relationship with us, and have no compunction about doing any of the crap they’re pulling.
Good point. But perhaps the average 14-15 year old might not have those connections and see it as easy cash right there at the mall?
oops–meant to reply to brianc…
With the ECOATMS (haven’t seen any others around), the seller has to be 18 and provide picture id that matches the person standing at the machine. Could be faked of course, but it also could be an obstacle to an easy transaction.
The scrap metal industry is a far bigger problem than the phone recyclers.
If these are gang initiations–which I already assumed (thanks to my law enforcement education via prime time TV)–then the kids doing the deeds don’t need the connections to unload the loot. They’re just retrieving it and handing it in.
The idea that older kids are getting younger kids to do their dirty work because they’ll get off easier makes perfect sense to me.
Build a Berlin Wall on Memorial and Candler.
Clearly a slow day at work for some of you.
Thankfully it was a quiet holiday. Lots of back and forth so just a couple of points I haven’t seen made yet (or missed):
-The perps are becoming increasingly brazen and violent as time goes on (from unoccupied home burglaries to armed robberies and a carjacking). This is an ESCALATING criminal trend and if it continues someone is going to get hurt. It’s very important to report ANY and ALL suspicious activity to police immediately even if it feels politically incorrect to do so. An innocent bored teenager can endure being asked a few questions by police if it means the next mom taking her kids for an afternoon in the park isn’t shot to death.
-Lots of commentary on here about arming up. A word of caution: a firearm is not a magic wand that will scare away thugs. Years ago I personally witnessed an incident where a violent aggressor was undeterred even in the face of a 12 gauge shotgun. Luckily no one was badly hurt then; but the point is merely showing a criminal you have a gun will not always stop them, you have to be willing to use it without hesitation and before the person gets close enough to grab it away from you. A gun should only be produced if you have already made a clear decision to shoot and kill. Obviously that is not a decision to be taken lightly and in my own opinion, anyone buying a gun for self defense should have a long hard conversation with themselves before being confronted with a potentially deadly situation. Pulling a gun, then hesitating or not using it at all are probably far more dangerous than not having one to begin with. Chances are, the perp takes your gun away and uses it on you or someone else. Just food for thought.
-There’s a community meeting with police this coming Monday night at the Solarium, correct? Informal show of hands, how many are going to attend?
Stay safe. Be mindful.