Sunday Liquor Sales Bill Could Be Dead Again
Decatur Metro | February 17, 2011It’s sorta inhumane how frequently this bill is brought back to life, and then sanctimoniously killed. The AJC reports this morning that Senate Bill 10 may be dead after the Senate Rules Committee decided not to move it to the floor for a vote. Why?
….Republicans held a caucus vote to see where senators stood on the issue, and the bill failed to gain support, so Senate leadership decided to not bring it forward for a vote.
“Having a caucus vote determining what bills come the floor and what bills do not actually to my knowledge has not been done in the past. So this is a little bit of a change in the procedure with the Senate, and the minority party is pretty much shut out of the process,” [Lt. Gov. Casey] Cagle said.
Over on Fresh Loaf, Thomas Wheatley offers this aside…
(Oh, and Christian conservatives shouldn’t get all the blame for this foul-up. Word is that some senators with ambitions for higher office refused to support the measure. While it the measure was popular in their own districts, they feared a “yes” vote would bite them in the behind when they eventually ran statewide.)
Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!
Why do we hear again and again, and in the context of this law and other laws, that common sense and needed reform fails because our elected reps, personally support a bill but are afraid to publicly support change due to fear of the various “coalition” groups. When are they going to be a leader?
The right. All for personal freedom, as long as their own church approves.
the good ol’ “seperation” of church and state strike again!
In Georgia, the party of big government is the Republican Party.
Failure to bring SB10 to the floor for a vote is a sign the Republican Party is the party of big Government?
In terms of continuing to interfere with private morality and perpetuating the establishment of law based on religious preferences, yes, they are.
The Republicans have controlled both houses of the General Assembly and Governor’s office since 2005. That’s it in the State’s entire history. 6 years. From 1891 to 2003, the Democratic Party controlled both the House and Senate and the Governor’s office. 112 years. Yeah, right. It’s the Republican Party’s fault. Where was the Democratic Party prior to 2005 in repealing laws based on religious preference? By the way, I’m not a Republican.
Oh, I don’t claim any high ground for Georgia Democrats, and certainly not the ones from years past, who were in many cases some of the most vile, racist, ignorant buffoons imaginable.
True. And most of them defected en masse to the GOP after Nixon’s “Southern Initiative” back in the early 70’s.
Yes, perhaps, but they were Democrats before they were reformed were they not? If you widen your horizon a bit you will still find that the left still has a lot of purging of their ranks to do.
Consider the Palm Spring “progressives” and their attacks on Clarence Thomas. It appears to me that in the competition to determine which is party contains the most vocal and largest numbers of vile, racist, and repugnant individuals that the Democratic Party seems to hold the edge.
BTW, I am neither a democrat nor a republican so I don’t have a dog in the “which party is worst” fight. I consider myself a Liberatarian and therefore am quite satisfied that the party that best represents my views really does not care what I do on Sunday, or in the bedroom, and would like to leave the contents of wallet in my wallet to the greatest extent possible.
Word.
Yeah, sorry, Skep, but what you said still doesn’t change the fact that the shift in demographics means that most of those vile, bigoted, xenophobic ultra-conservatives who were Democrats (at least, in the South) are now Republicans. And the attacks on Clarence Thomas, to the extent that they weren’t justified, paled in comparison to the personal smears Anita Hill endured for daring to speak out about her experiences with him. As for his performance on the SCt, he is sorely lacking in all but the ability to parrot Scalia.
Hi Cuba,
I was probably asleep at the wheel at the time, but I don’t recall anyone suggesting that Anita Hill should be lynched or enslaved as proud progressives have called for Justice Thomas.
The appalling thing is not that a few idiots can run their mouths and get air time. It is apalling that those who have called the Tea Party (and others) as being bigoted racists with nothing more than the fact that the Tea Party opposes the accuser’s politics – can’t seem to find it within themselves to condemn attrocious behavior when it originates from left side of the aisle.
If you don’t recall the virtual lynching Anita Hill received when she made her accusations, then you were either too young to have been interested in watching/following politics, or you were indeed asleep at the wheel. As for suggestions from “progressives” that Justice Thomas should be lynched, I’m certainly not privy to those, but if such things were said, they belong right at the bottom of the garbage heap with the things done to Ms. Hill.
I find it very interesting that when conservatives/right-wingers are called on their nonsense, they find it incumbent to try to point a finger at the left. I don’t think the left is pristine by any long shot, but when it comes to downright insane levels of vitriol against those who disagree with them, the right is either getting the most press, or they’re really the lunatic fringe they appear to be. I personally have not read or heard of venom spewed by the left that is anywhere close to the violent outrage expressed by the right, but I’m willing to be educated. So, educate me, Skeptic: please find & post some of these “attrocities” committed by the left, about which you claim everyone is silent. I’m always willing to see whether there is balance in the Force.
Here you go Cuba, a couple of links to pick from.
http://www.examiner.com/conservative-in-spokane/video-shows-progressive-protesters-calling-for-lynching-of-clarence-thomas
http://hotair.com/archives/2011/02/03/video-koch-protests-include-calls-to-lynch-clarence-thomas/
This IS bad. It’s interesting that one of the posters in the first article you link to provides a link that indicates the videographer, purportedly a conservative blogger/”journalist”, was actually egging them on! Granted, they didn’t seem to need much “egging”, but Common Cause (whose rally it was) wasted no time in steadfastly denouncing them (as well it should have). OK, so you gave me two links about one (really nasty) incident…was this all you could find? (If I’m being honest, I have to admit I found the dentally-impaired woman challenging Glenn Beck to a duel hilarious– anyone who could take her seriously needs to get a grip. Beck himself obviously doesn’t seem to have been frightened by her…and he spews far worse on his show every week!)
Pound for pound, though, I’m still not seeing evidence that the left out-nasties the right (or even equals it). I don’t recall the Tea Party leadership denouncing the death threats and slurs made by its followers at their rallies (in fact, they seemed to ratchet up the rhetoric whenever they were criticized for it.) Lefties also don’t tend to pack heat at their political shindigs in nearly the same numbers that righties do (I’d guess that’s b/c most lefties don’t own guns), so they’re automatically less dangerous!
Hi Cuba,
I don’t know how much more is out there. I didn’t try for an exhaustive search. I was specifically referring to this video in my post.
Whether the left pack heat or not I don’t know, but I’d challenge you to a video of a tea partier brandishing a weapon or calling for a lynching.
You think the right has looked the other way regarding the Tea Party – please show me where.
In the meantime, where is Jesse Jackson, the NAACP, SCLC, Moveon.Org, etc. and why have they not said a word in the defese of Clarence Thomas and his wife.
These, and other, organizations take a high and mighty stand against any rightly (or wrongly for that matter) in justice – but only when it suits their political agenda.
The hypocracy is nauseating.
Either you stand up consistenly for what is right or you don’t.
This will be entertaining.
I hate this f***in’ state!
If the majority of people in Georgia were Jewish or Buddhist this draconian liquor law would not exist. I’m so sick of Christianity being shoved down my throat. What am I missing? Isn’t this law unconstitutional since it technically violates the separation of church and state?
Wow.
Double wow. It really isn’t because so many of the legislators are Christian, it’s because they want Christians’ votes (or what they think will be Christians’ votes). There are many, many Christians who aren’t Southern Baptist who would love for this law to be repealed, myself amongst them.
These blue laws are absurd. They are an infringement on freedom and an example of why the Republican Party is not bigger. If the Christian Right was not so vocal, Republicans would get more support. It’s a shame that these same “limited government” types only want it that way on the issues they agree with. Having said that, Sarah, the law is not unconstitutional as a violation of “church and state”. The first amendment prevents the govt. from passing a law that establishes a religion or prevents the free exercise of a religion. Sunday blue laws do neither. The words “separation of church and state” do not appear in Constitution. This is not a “separation of church and state” issue, it is a simple freedom issue.
If it is not a nod to Christians then why is the day in question Sunday? They want us all to be good worker bees and not be hungover come Monday?
I don’t have a dog in this fight, so I don’t care either way what happens. But I am surprised at the vehemence of the commenters on this post.
I am not asking this to cause trouble; I’m just curious: Why are people reacting so strongly? What is it that brings out such feelings of hatred for Georgia and its leadership?
And before any responders decide to attack me for my political affiliation, please note that I’m not religious, have nothing against alcohol (man, I love Newcastle!), and believe strongly in the separation of church and state.
Because it’s an antiquated blue law designed to enforce religious standards. It’s unconstitutional and for me personally, as a non-Christian, offensive.
Because it’s BS ‘Christian’ morality being crammed down our throats by two faced Republican politicians that 5 minutes later will take a strong stand in favor of the freedom of poor people to die without health care. Because that is what Jesus would do.
And before someone makes the brain dead comment that “yeah, well Democrats ….” So what? Calling out the self righteous BS of the ruling party in this state does not require you to also say that the other party is flawless. The Republican party of this state owns this, they are infringing on my personal liberty, and yet they pander to their brain dead base as the champions of liberty.
Ok, fine, I need to go have another beer. Hope your happy!
Dammit! I demand my right to carry my concealed handgun into my local liquor store on Sunday and demand my Fullers ESB.
… hang on, I think my wife is coming to take my keyboard away…
So I just read the article again, and I’m not seeing the “Georgia politicians are forcing Christianity on us” argument put forth by Glockenspieler and Sarah.
What I do see is legislators who are responding to their constituents’ wishes. Yes, they (the constituents) are Christians, and motivated by their own sense of morality, but they are also voters who have the power to vote the legislators out of office. Isn’t this the way politics work in America? For example, a lot of Americans wanted reform of the financial system, and a reform bill was passed. That was an example of our elected leadership responding to the will of the people, just as the Sunday liquor sales decision was a response to the will of Georgia voters who made their wishes clear.
Sarah, why is it unconstitutional? Georgia voters elected people into office for reasons of their own, and those electees are making laws based upon what their voters want.
One more thing…is it now socially acceptable to hate on Christians? Everyone got tired of hating Jews and Muslims, so they had to turn their prejudices against someone else?
I have to disagree with you a bit on this DTR. I don’t think the majority of constituents in any district is against repealing this law. Every poll shows that at least 75-80% of Georgians want Sunday sales. I think the politicians are listening to a very vocal minority that does NOT represent the will of the people.
Not sure you are correct about those polls. The ones I’ve seen show that south Georgia takes nearly the opposite position of metro Atlanta on the issue. Of course, that doesn’t mean they aren’t in the minority overall, but if you’ve lived for any time in Georgia you know that a rural minority carries a lot of weight in state politics.
Agreed. I saw an article that stated that certain state legislatures that are in a district that heavily supports Sunday sales are reluctant to back the bill because of future state wide political aspirations.
Furthermore, our politicians should not just gauge the “will of the people” when taking a position. We elect them to make informed decision on our behalf, not to take a poll of their constituents and take a position based on the majority. As i’m sure a good Republican would know, the founding fathers were scared sh*tless of a majority rules philosophy.
The problem with it being unconstitutional is proving the intent of the law is to impose religion. In cases where school districts have tried to teach religion as science, courts have found the intent easily discernible, but these blue laws are so old I’d imagine it would be difficult to prove intent. I also doubt , from a legal standpoint, that they would be judged an imposition of religion just because they apply to Sunday.
Also, probably the only ones with both significant monetary interest involved and the legal standing required to challenge these laws are grocery stores, and they wouldn’t do it because of pr issues.
The grocery lobbyist were very busy last week.
“That was an example of our elected leadership responding to the will of the people, just as the Sunday liquor sales decision was a response to the will of Georgia voters who made their wishes clear.”
I’m sorry, Token, but that is complete and utter BS. Statewide polls have shown 70%+ support for ending the Sunday blue laws. It is even higher in Metro Atlanta.
The reality is that a minority of Republican State Senators got to decide for the rest of the state to use the power of Big Government to infringe on the liberties of all Georgia citizens.
This is a story, not because the Democrats didn’t repeal it for years either (most of those “Democrats” now call themselves Republicans, BYW). It is a story because this shows that a party who claims the mantle of small government and personal liberty, really loves to use the power of Big Government when it comes to doing things they want.
If this were put up for a full vote, it would pass. But a minority of Republican legislators don’t want to have to make that vote.
Personally, DTR, it really isn’t that big of a deal to me either. If this was the only way certain politicians tried to inject their religious beliefs into policy, I’d rest pretty easy. This is far from being the worst example. I do think it makes Georgia look backwards compared to most of the country. But what else is knew, huh?
Georgia is not alone. Many states have Sunday blue laws as silly as they seem to us today. I agree with you that it isn’t that big of a deal compared to other infringements on personal liberty and private property rights. It’s way down the list. However, most were passed through the legislative process so if we don’t like them we can vote out the politicians. Fortunately, they are gradually disappearing.
Good point. Personally I find it amusing that one of the two other states that doesn’t sell liquor on Sundays is the perhaps the bluest state in the country.
Nutmeggers are proud to be full of contradictions !
Weren’t we the first to have blue laws ? I think I remember that from CT history class.
Puritans and fundamentalists have a lot in common other than a 300 year difference.
14 States continue to cling to Prohibition-era Blue Laws banning Sunday liquor sales. They include: Alabama, Connecticut, Georgia, Indiana, Minnesota, Mississippi, Montana, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, and West Virginia. Notably, Connecticut, Georgia and Indiana are the only three states in the country that ban beer, wine and liquor on Sundays.
http://www.prohibitionrepeal.com/legacy/hall.asp
Given that:
A) Indiana, Georgia and Connecticut all ban Sunday sales outright
and
B) Indiana and Connecticut both voted for Obama in 2008
Therefore:
C) It is obviously the fault of northern Democrats that we can’t purchase beer on Sunday.
Many of these states allow the sale of beer and wine on Sunday even if they prohibit liquor sales. I believe that was all this legislation in Georgia was going to allow.
My parents live in Indiana which also has blue laws. Recently, the state legislature discussed repealing the laws, but the liquor store owners were against it. Why? Because grocery stores (which are already open on Sunday) would sell alcohol just as a matter of business. But the liquor stores would need to be open an extra day and pay to staff that day when they predict that there wouldn’t be an overall increase in sales for the week.
Think about it. I’ve made a last-minute Saturday night run to the store to buy alcohol for the Sunday football game. They’ve got us trained to compensate for the blue laws, so there’s little upside for the liquor stores to be open on Sunday.
Perhaps this isn’t just a morality issue, but one that some business are pushing too. It’d be interesting to find out.
I’d imagine the restaurant industry is against it too. I wonder how Georgia restaurants (that serve booze) do on Sunday compared to states without these laws?
Thanks – thanks for noting that this is not soley a morality issue. In fact, I think that’s the lesser driver. The liquor / distributor lobby is this state is as powerful as any other political force.
The ‘baptist bloc’ drives me crazy sometimes, but let’s not lay this all at their feet. If they were the only ones opposing this, it would already have passed.
Brianc and Queen B are right about the resturant lobby wanting the ban to stay in place. There are always multiple factors playing in to every political decision; that’s why it’s called political calculus.
I don’t find this frustrating because the proponents of the blue laws are primarily religious nut cases. Their motivations are meaningless to me. I find this apalling because it is an infringement on liberty that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, religious or secular. Irrationality is irrationality, who cares if it is religious in nature?
Obviously it is illegal to drink on Sundays. It is even legal to buy alcohol on Sunday at a bar or restaurant. So the blue laws serve no purpose other than to force Sunday drinkers to go to a bar to drink or plan ahead if they intend to drink at home. The notion that the government has any business telling me that, on a Sunday, I can but a beer at Brick Store, but not at Publix, is patently illogical and pointless. That it happens to have a religious underpinning is beside the point.
These kinds of completely arbitrary infringements of freedom are absolutely maddening. The state republicans should be ashamed at this, but of course they aren’t. They’re pathetic.
The bigger issue is allowing residents to choose. They could easily resolve this issue by allowing this to be enabling legislation that provides for a referendum on Sunday sales for each county, if they so choose. This way the legislator with state-wide aspirations could hide behind the cause of “giving citizens choice.” Done deal. With each passing day I’m seeing how troubling it is that GA is not being led by leaders of the people but men and women more concerned with their own personal aspirations.
BTW – There is no separation of church and state issue.
That is precisely what this legislation was to do.
Walrus,
That makes it even more criminal. No spine!!
Agreed.
Of course it is a church/state issue. While the Supreme Court may not think so, blue laws violate the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment. The ONLY reason these laws were implemented was to further Christian values. Courts have ruled that, with the passage of time, these laws have now become part of ‘tradition’ rather than having religious significance. I find this argument to be silly. But that’s me.
This reminds me of a great bumper sticker I saw:
It’s your Hell, you burn in it.